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Lamentation Analysis on StarCraft 2 (Part 2)

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1 Lamentation Analysis on StarCraft 2 (Part 2) on Fri Dec 04, 2015 10:03 am

Hello again everybody. Welcome back to part 2 of my analysis of StarCraft 2, now we get to the incoherent mess that is Heart of the Swarm.

Before I begin, I'd like to start by talking about what I felt was the biggest mistake made to the series, which involves HotS's central character, the woman who's importance in the series has been cranked up past 11 until the knob broke off. I am of course talking about Sarah Kerrigan.
This is a issue that I've dubbed The Separation of Ghost and Queen, or How the Queen Bitch of the Universe was ruined.
The biggest misstep with StarCraft 2 was the push to turn Kerrigan into a sympathetic hero in this series, I loved Kerrigan as a villain, her rise to power during Brood Wars was what made her legendary, on par with some of the greatest villains in all of fiction.
She was a victim, who turned into a murderer because of betrayal and suffering, and that aspect of her story was far more compelling than any of the so called development she goes through in this story.
She was a character we loved to hate, because as after the death of the Overmind and her shared victory over the U.E.D. she had the chance to forget the past and help build a better future, but instead made the conscious decision to give in to pointless revenge and a lust for power.
She was turned into a monster and didn't want to go back, she stared into the abyss and liked what she saw, and StarCraft 2's half-hearted attempt to destroy that aspect of her character, by removing the agency of her actions is frankly and insult to the series as a whole, because now all the interesting choices she made are either the fault of some underdeveloped alien being or a split personality.

She wasn't an interesting villain in StarCraft 1, after all she was just another disposable pawn under the Overminds control, and her character could have literally been another cerebrate, and just like how they ruined the Overmind in WoL, they removed the impact that her choices had on the story by turn her into a third string mook.

Now on to the analysis proper, if you've read through the first part, you'll know how this works, here's everything I found to be plot holes, inconsistencies, retcons, or just issues that broke my emersion of the story.

1. We begin with, what I won't deny is an amazing cut scene of Kerrigan leading the swarm on Korhal, which is anybody reading this has read my version of how StarCraft 2 should have been, this is exactly the direction the story should have gone. But immediately afterward we are subjected to a conversation between Kerrigan and Raynor that's forced and melodramatic, if fact throughout the majority of this story she comes across as Anakin Skywalker from the prequels, and overpowered brat full of angst.

2. Why does Kerrigan go on an unwarranted rampage in the labs? I  find it hard to believe that Kerrigan woke up one day and was told that for the last five years, she butchered over 8 billion people as the leader of a race of xenomorphs and her first act is to cause massive amounts of needless destruction and put peoples lives at risk, considering that this is suppose to be the Sarah Kerrigan personality that objected to unleashing the zerg on a civilian population not once but twice. We're also told repeatedly thought this story that Kerrigan has no memory of her time as the Queen of Blades, yet she talks about the dangers of the swarm with a certainty that contradict that very idea, so right in the tutorial mission, we see that the writer don't know whether Kerrigan is a pathological psycho or victim of circumstance.

3. When did Kerrigan become a jedi? In the previous cut scene we see Kerrigan putting together some kind of ball using the Force, this always reminds me of a similar scene from The Force Unleashed when Starkiller put together his lightsaber in the exact same manner. This is an issue I've touched on before, about how characters and concepts have been super charged from the previous series more grounded tone to the point that this setting has been turned into a Fantasy/Super Hero/Anime series, after all before Kerrigan was just a special ops soldiers with some minor telepathic powers, but now she can force lift objects, and shoot psychic blasts, and apparently she's the only ghosts in the series that's this powerful, why? Because now she's officially the most powerful psychic of her time. Sure, whatever you say Blizzard, I'm also certain that if you do some blood work on her, we'd find out that her midiclorian count is over 20,000 as well.

4. It's at this point that Mengsk attacks the station that he somehow knows Kerrigan is being kept in because of course he's stupid evil and the first thing he wants to do is assassinate one person with a fleet of battlecruisers instead of trying something more covert like any sane person would and during her escape Kerrigan runs into a group of free Zerg that are rampaging through the station and instead of taking control of them like she did only a few hours ago, she decides now that she "shouldn't" try to control them. Why? If all she wants is to escape with Raynor into the sunset, wouldn't it have been easier to turn the zerg on the dominion, or at least keep them away so that they don't have to fight both alien bugs and space marines.

5. This is more a matter of opinion and I know that, but at this point I'd like to say that the voice acting done for Kerrigan is horrible, especial in these early missions, and of course she's being voiced by Tricia Helfer, because when companies want an easy sci-fi female actor she's their first pick, to be frank, I think she's been playing too many machine characters that she's forgotten how to act as a human.

6. Why doesn't Kerrigan force lift Raynor across the bridge? We see in the next scene that she's capable, she lifts up two of Valerians guards and slams then across the room at once, if she had done that to Raynor in the station they could have escaped together, but nobody can make a reasonable choice that would keep Kerrigan from turning into the Queen of the Zerg in this story, so let's move on.

7. What's Valerians endgame? He wanted to defeat the Queen of Blades because that's the one thing his Father could do, and he's done it, what exactly does he get by siding with Raynor and Kerrigan? Especially since he knows how ruthless his father is, Mengsk at this point could just publicly denounce Valerian as a traitor and cut him off from ever being the next Emperor, which is the only thing Valerian wanted out of all of this to begin with.

8. Now in the Rendezvous mission, Kerrigan takes control of a Zerg hive to destroy a pulse cannon. What was that she said one mission ago about how she thinks she should control the zerg again? So when it was a matter of life of death escaping from multiple strike squads it wasn't okay to control the Zerg but know that it's a live or death situation involving a space cannon, know it's okay.

9. In the following cutscene, we learn that Raynor has been captured, and apparently executed. Does anyone remember that line of dialogue from WoL about how Mengsk hasn't had Raynor assassinated because he didn't want to turn Raynor into a Martyr? Wouldn't declaring that Raynor's been executed turn him into a martyr anyway? Which reminds me what ever did happen to that civilian uprising on Korhal from the last game?, there's a plot line that went nowhere, but knowing StarCraft 2 Mengsk he probably had everyone on Korhal executive too.

10. So Kerrigan wants to rule the Zerg again so that she can use them as weapons to kill Mengsk, okay makes sense so far, so she goes to Kaldir to find a brood to join her, okay how did she know there would be one on Kaldir, whatever so she gets to Kaldir and finds out that the broodmother who was there has been killed by the Protoss who have set up a colony there and she decides to slaughter them all. What? Why? Did she want revenge for the Broodmother? I thought she just wanted to use the Zerg to kill Mengsk.

11. Why doesn't Kerrigan leave Kaldir? The kidnapped Protoss herself makes a reasonable point, if Kerrigan left right then and there she could be long gone by the time the golden armada shows up. But because no one in this story has a brain, she stays to kill all the Protoss on the planet, and when they try to leave on there own, she implants a zerg parasite into her captive, lets the Protoss teleport her onto their ship, and instructs the parasite into killing the entire crew, Kerrigan is suppose to be a hero right? Not a sociopath? And in the end we are left with a Protoss ship that's infested with Zerg which are never heard from again. There's a plot that goes nowhere.        

12. In the cutscene after the Kaldir missions, we see Zeratul has snuck onboard the Leviation, when he reveals himself to Kerrigan she screams out his name and goes ape shit trying to kill him, how would she know him? Again we are told repeatedly by Kerrigan herself that she doesn't have any memories of her time as the Queen of Blades, which is when she first met Zeratul, so how could she possibly know who he is?

13. And here we continue with the ruination of Zeratuls character, as he continues his role from WoL as nothing more then an exposition dumping card board cutout, talking nonsense about prophesy and believe.

14. And now we're back on Char, you know, one of the few things that I can positively talk about when it comes to StarCraft 2 are the new side characters that have been introduced, Horner, Swamm, Izsha, Tychus, Zagara, Abathur. As I've said before all the returning characters are generic card board cutout of what they used to be, to the point where they don't have character, yet the side characters even when they get their moments to shine like Tychus in the Odin, they still feel like grounded people, which is something StarCraft 2 needed more of. But ever rule has it's exception and that mans name is General Warfield. Warfield is a microcosm of what is wrong with the writing of StarCraft 2, here we have this character who's a major war veteran, a leader of men, who when the Queen of Blades came back, Emperor Mengsk pulled him out of retirement to lead the Dominion armies, yet he is incompetent to the point of being infuriating, in WoL he has a line about leading 4 battles against the Zerg and given what we've seen from him I have to wonder about the details of those battles, was it him and 20 Marines verse a single zergling and he just happened to be the only survivor? From his nonexistent defense of Korhal during the media blitz missions, to his idiocy regarding nuking the infested platform during the invasion of Char, I mean series just nuke the coolant towers jackass! And now we're back on Char and his brilliant strategy boils down to him screaming "Put out another Gorgon!" You'd think after losing six of 'em he try something else. Speaking of stupid, as an aside to something I said about the characterization for Emperor Mengsk, we see in this game alone that he has the resource to have built at least 7 Gorgon Battle cruisers, Archangel mechs, The Hybrid breading facility, and a fully functional Psi-Destroyer, and still when it came to digging up the artifact piece on Mar Sara, he chose to work civilians to death todig them up, Emperor Mengsk everybody, the most cartoonishly evil villain since Ming, the merciless.

15. In the Conscience cutscene, Kerrigan let's Warfields soldiers escape, why? Warfields men were just as eager to kill Kerrigan as the Protoss on Kaldir, so why let them live now?

16. After that is a conversation with Izsha, Kerrigan has a line about "Paying for our actions." Does she mean like the 8 Billion people that she murdered, oh on that can't be what she's taking about because that was a split personality of hers.

17. So now the Zerus section of the game. We get more exposition from the ancient one, and retconning concerning the Zerg and the Overmind. In StarCraft 1 the Overmind felt like a force of nature, but like Kerrigan it turns out to be nothing more than a mook.

18. So we get confirmation that Amon created the Overmind and used it to enslave the zerg to his will, again in StarCraft 1 the Overmind itself stated that it's goal was to assimilate the Protoss to make the Zerg a perfect race, so was the Overmind, the godlike entity that it was, lying to it's cerebrates? It own minions that couldn't turn on it even if they knew the truth.

19. Why didn't Zeratul find out about Amon when he connected with the Overmind?

20. If the Overmind could go against Amon, how was it able to create the Queen of Blades, since creating her was part of a plan to defy Amon? Which required the Overmind to be killed somehow, and even then it didn't work since Amon started "influencing" Kerrigan anyways. It seems like this entire plot line only worked thanks to plot convince.

21. Kerrigan's transformation has all the stubbly of an episode of Dragon Ball Z. Quick what does the scanner say about her power level?

22. Raynors alive, like I didn't see that coming.

23. In the first of the Skygeirr missions, Infested, Kerrigan infests multiple marine garrisons to use as cannon fodder and break into the labs. This is suppose to be the same Kerrigan that didn't want to unleash the Zerg on the confederacy, yet she's infesting marines by the dozens and when they're killed by the toxic gas all she has to say is that she's got plenty more to spare, that they're only killing themselves. I'm confused again, this isn't suppose to be the sociopath Kerrigan anymore right?

24. How does Kerrigan know about the Hybrids? I'll say it as many times as it takes to sink in, she doesn't have any memories of her time as the Queen of Blades. So how does she remember the Hybrids?

25. Zombie Zerg Stukov. Stukov had a great death scene in Brood Wars, but his return and the circumstances around it just takes all the impact that scene had out of it. It's just like Barbossa's return in the Pirate of the Caribbean series, it's completely pointless and leads to nothing other than a shity cameo.

26. Stukov has a line about He and Kerrigan once being enemies, even though he was already dead when she first revealed herself to the U.E.D.

27. There's another line about how Protoss/Zerg Fusion should not be possible, and again as before with the retcons, originally Protoss could be infested by the Zerg, in Brood Wars that what Kerrigan did to Martarck Rashagal, and in the early stages of WoL there were plans to put in infested Protoss units that got scraped, this retcon serves no purpose and creates plot holes within StarCraft 1's story, was it really necessary to include it? Since Infestation is a relatively simple process but a perfect fusion would require advance knowledge in bioengineering, which would still require Xel'Naga knowledge.

28. As we go into the mission, Hand of Darkness, I'd like to introduce a new segment called "The Writers Thinks Your Stupid". Let's Begin with the introduction of "Dr. Narud" I mean seriously? This ultra intelligent, god-like, alien, chessmaster character, desired that the best way to hide himself was to reverse his name? I can only imagine somebody at Blizzard said, "People won't believe he's Duran, even if we tell them or hint at it, unless we spell his name backwards." My problem with Duran, I refuse to call him Narud, is the same thing that I've mentioned before with the other main characters, maybe it's just me, but I always thought Duran was just some Terran that came into contact with the Xel'Naga and was working as their agent in exchange for power, never did I imagine that he would be turned into an alien shapeshifter, consider all the questions that come up when you take that into account.

29. If Duran was always a perfect shapeshifter, he could change is appearance, voice and even clothes (how the hell that's possible, I'll never know.), Then he could have done so much more to advance Amon's plans. For Example why didn't he kill and impersonate Mengsk, he apparently has been working for him and given is manipulative nature could have done so, with the dominions resources at his disposals he probably could have set up multiple hybrid labs on ever dominion world, and imagine during the invasion of Korhal if Kerrigan were to have reached Mengsk only to find Duran and learn that he had already been dead for years, or even impersonate Valerian or both? Blizzard turned Duran into a shapeshifter, and did absolutely nothing with him, so why bother? Then there's his fight scene with Kerrigan, were we see him shooting red plasma balls and his eyes are glowing red, because he's a bad guy and bad guys have red color schemes, and we believe our audience is 12 years old.

30. Now lets think about what Duran has been doing, given the new information we have so far. Duran is the leader of the Tal'Drim, who were guarding the majority of the Xel'Naga artifact pieces thought WoL, and yet even though Duran needs the artifact to collect Kerrigan energy to resurrect Amon, he doesn't just order the Tal'Drim to bring the pieces that they had already to him? He's also the head of the Mobious foundation, working for Valerian to find the pieces, which he already knows where they are, but when a Mobious team is sent to dig up the piece hidden inside the temple, the one that needs to be open with the laser drill, he let the Tal'Drim kill the expedition team? Why? And after that they also attack Raynor, who's also looking for the pieces for the Mobious foundation, even though his contact is Tychus, who was freed from prison by Mengsk and Valerian should have known about it, am I the only one who sees how poorly thought the writing is?

31. The "With Friends Like These..." Mission is probably the best mission in HotS, it's a clear continuation of the Coronal Orson plotline from WoL, the humor is tongue firmly in cheek while still intelligent, and the Star Wars/Zap Branigan quotes are icing on the cake.
At this point, I'd like to say that I found most, not all, but most of these missions to be boring, it's a feeling I also got the last time I played WoL, and I think it's the hidden clock missions that really kill this game for me, since most of the missions require you to rush through them in order to not fail, I never have time to develop my own playstyle on repeat plays, thought most of WoL I just spammed the mercenary compound, which meant I had been using the same units again and again, and in HotS, I usually stick with 3 for 1 instants zerglings, maybe I'm the only person with this problem, but all of this is my personal analysis anyways.

32. During "Conviction" this time around I caught something I always missed on previous plays, it's very subtle but when I discovered it, I thought my brain had began to internally swell. But the inside corridors of the prison ship is lined with Missile Turrets. I will give you a moment to think on that. The inside corridors of a prison starship is lined with anti-air missile turrets. There's two glaring issues with that. One from a setting perspective, did the Dominion at some point have to deal with somebody flying a Waith or a Banshee inside the prison ship? Cause god dam, I'd rather be playing that mission. Second from a logical perspective, Having a Missile Tureen inside a starship, especially one as small as the Moros, would be like having a turbo lasers on the inside of a Star Destroyer, or a rocker launcher inside a airplane, as soon as it fires, everyone's gonna have a bad time. Third from a level design perspective, it's completely pointless, you can build your own units during this mission, and your given only ground zerg units, so there is no reason for them to be in the level at all!

33. Kerrigan infests the prisoners on the Moros. Queen bitch of the universe is right.

34. Where did Kerrigan get Raynor's gun? Why would it be on the prison ship in the first place?

35. Valerian asks Kerrigan to avoid killing civilians and she agrees? So when a random Protoss asks you to not kill needlessly you say no, but when Warfield and Valerian ask you say yes. Does her not murder people policy apply only to terrans or? Cause there were people on the prison ship who were just trying to run away.  

35. I believe it's after the first mission on Korhal that Kerrigan says "All the pain you've caused will come back to you." Really Kerrigan, you mean like 8 Billion lives worth of pain.

36. I'm assuming most of you remember when the ending to HotS was leaked. It was pretty much exactly what you got here, except the twist was that Kerrigan had a killswitch implanted into her neck this entire time. Mengsk sure loves his killswitchs doesn't he? My point is we know that the artifact was not originally going to be here, the original ending got leaked people hated it and Blizzard decided that they would slap the artifact into the scene, it's becomes even more of a problem in LotV, but the issue I have with that is, the artifact is literally a deus machina that blizzard uses to continue the story when they can't think of anything else. So now the artifact can collect energy, deinfest terran, and shoot lightning. This thing is more versatile than a Magic Bullet I wonder if can ground coffee beans too? Can it mix margaritas? Does it come with a juicer attachment? Well for only three easy payment you too can find out.

37. Then Kerrigan shoots psionics into Mengsks face, and the room blows up. This reminds me of Jaws 3, when Mrs.. Brody rams the shark with her boat and the shark just explodes cause the writers are hack frauds.

38. And finally Kerrigan floats with the wind because.....she's Like a dandelion??? She isn't flying, cause she doesn't have real wings, it's not psionics, cause there's no humming noise of ball of light around her, I'm assuming it's suppose to be symbolic somehow, but Raynor is watching her do this, which means it's actually happening.....Maybe Her people need her. So yes literally fuck off into the void of space and we never have to see her again, until WoO that is.



Last edited by theshadowcouncil on Fri Dec 04, 2015 5:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

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While I'm eagerly awaiting if Arch responds, because there is little actually that I even wish to try and refute because I found HotS so bad story-wise, but your point about Protoss not being able to be infested is a retcon is actually not true. Raszagal was not infested by Kerrigan, she was mind controlled, as Arch pointed out in his stream.

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Corwinus wrote:While I'm eagerly awaiting if Arch responds, because there is little actually that I even wish to try and refute because I found HotS so bad story-wise, but your point about Protoss not being able to be infested is a retcon is actually not true. Raszagal was not infested by Kerrigan, she was mind controlled, as Arch pointed out in his stream.

When exactly did Kerrigan gain that ability?

Why is that never explained in the story?

Why has it never been brought up again?

Just because Arch has an answer, it does mean it's going to make sense, or that it's cannon.

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Well I'd like to add something theshadowcouncil already basicly hit all the points HotS story is bad, I would like Arche to respond as well tho perhaps I missed something in the 2 times I completed it(damn achievements got em all tho I think) that makes it not as bad as I remember.

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ZeroCool wrote:Well I'd like to add something theshadowcouncil already basicly hit all the points HotS story is bad, I would like Arche to respond as well tho perhaps I missed something in the 2 times I completed it(damn achievements got em all tho I think) that makes it not as bad as I remember.

Doesn't look likely at this point. ( ̄へ ̄)

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1. You state opinion that the conversation is forced and melodramatic, but please be more specific. In my opinion it was definiately dramatic, but forced? Not really. I think it makes full sense that Kerrigan wants Mengsk dead. Even more so than Raynor does. Arch covered this in his lorerun.

2. She does it to make a point. Remember, she saw Zerg invasion on Tarsonis with her own eyes, and she does have certain flashes of the past as Queen of Blades. Even though she was not really there for the most part of the story, she does know Zerg better than anyone. And she better then anyone knows what ends up happening, when someone in position of power tries to experiment/or play with the Zerg. She definiately does not want it to repeat with Valerian.

3. Kerrigan is no longer really human. Her psychic abilities have been much more powerfull after transformation into Queen of Blades. Her retaining some percentage of her old power makes sense, considering she still has some alien DNA in her body. The fact noone says it flat out does not make it a plot-hole.

4. Do you really think any covert assasin would have any chances against Kerrigan and Raynor? Really? That's one thing. The other is - again, something Arch covered - Mengsk is breaking at this point. He is afraid of Kerrigan and Raynor and is slowly devolving, focusing his efforts just on killing her with his full force. If you recall, he sent Nova to get Kerrigan. That is literally her level of power and skill as a ghost. So... yeah, it makes sense.

5. She sounds as someone unstable. Although I would not place it as a specific point here, as it is purely opinion.

6. Well, lifting someone for a few seconds or tossing them with full force is different from slowly carrying them across a large space. We don't know how big the space between them is, we can only assume Kerrigan was not able to use her power on such a large distance.

7. Valerian wanted to make sure, that Kerrigan is no longer the threat, that's why he made all the tests. Raynor and others stayed... well, i don't think I have to explain why. Afterward, he probably was not feeling confident enough in just returning to Korhal. And Mengsk couldn't just denounce him, as it would undermine family name.

8. You clearly look for plot-holes where there are none. It was made a specific point that Kerrigan DOES NOT WANT to control the Zerg. She despises them. She used them only, because that was the only real thing to do for her. You DO realise, that people not always use all their strengh and power even when they need to? The fact that you have a gun does not mean you shoot everyone. This is such situation.

9. All was covered in lorerun. Raynor with Kerrigan became much more of a direct threat, especially with Valerian helping him out. Him becoming a martyr was secondary objective. Considering Zerg threat was over, people were not caring for one rebel. It's just how it works.

10. It was made a point, that Protoss discovered her presence. She needed to kill them, so that Golden Armada would not butcher her ass. That is clearly presented in game. Pay attention.

11. Do you really think that Golden Armada would just arrive, not notice Kerrigan and say "Oh fine, Queen of Blades is not here, chills". They would pursue her. And - as Arch made a point - she was really broken at this point. She just didn't think rationally. It makes sense for her to be acting like that. It doesn't take a sociopath to be brutal - although being sociopath makes a lot of real-life sense for both Raynor and Kerrigan, so shrug.

12. Two options - either she was told offscreen who Zeratul is, or it is a plot-hole as team did not have time to flesh it out. A plot-hole if you ask me.

13. How does that ruin his character? And how is this a nonsense, considering all that he knows? Hell, it makes sense that a proud Protoss would be a little off after learning all of this.

14. Calling Mengsk cartoonish is dumb. Nothing else to say, he was just as evil and stupid in StarCraft 1. And case of Warfield I would not treat with such a butthurt. It's difficult to write a good strategist, if you don't have real knowledge on tactis. I myself love warfare in fiction and studying it in real life, and still I am terrible in writing genius strategist. Thrawn was an exception by being actually smart tactical genius in lore and in action.

15. He mentioned Raynor. She felt guilty. Pay attention. And what more - those few wounded man would not call Golden Armada.

16. Again, you look for plot-holes where there are none. I myself have been in situations, where I was not really myself (being drung, or high for example, or both) and acted not like me. I had no control over what I was doing, still I felt guilty cause of my actions. It is called conscience.

17. The very fact someone is under control does not make them a mook. You just insulted Darth Vader, Golbez, Kefka, and like a hundred other villains. And what's more important, Overmind being artificial construct... kinda makes sense if you think about it.

18. Overmind did not need to... lie. He was imprisoned in his own mind. It's Borg effect. And as we know, Amon wanted to create hybrid from Protoss and Zerg. Protoss are much harder to control (by the time he created Overmind, Khala was not yet created). If Overmind was able to create hybrid by absorbing the Protoss, he would win immidiately. Had it failed, Protoss would be dead and Amon would have Zerg under his control, being able to freely create hyrbid on his own. Both are win scenarios for Amon. No problem here.

19. Cause Amon didn't reveal himself? Creation doesn't have to know the creator to realise he is bad news. Mass Effect 1 had simmilar situation with
Spoiler:
Rachni knowing something evil controlled them, yet not knowing what exactly.

20. Overmind had to work around his mind. Arch covered it in his lorerun. He was like droid in Star Wars. Droids cannot work against their programming, but they can work around it. It made sense for Overmind to implant itself into Aiur, or to create Kerrigan. Queen of Blades still ended up wrong, cause Overmind had to design her in a way that would fit Amon's plans. Queen of Blades was also kinda independent, so he could not literally write all the important elements into her brain. The point is, she was supposed to have been a force that blocked Zerg from Hybrid. And it kinda worked. It just required her being freed to turn Zerg against Amon.

21. Nitpick and taste issues. It was a well presented moment in my opinion.

22. You changing into CinemaSins now?

23. She has no choice. Plain and simple. Also - those are marines. Military. Not harmless civilians that were on Tarsonis. Difference between Alderaan and Death Star.

24. Stukov briefly explains what hybrid are. I guess Kerrigan figured out the rest. I never got the impression she knew exactly what hybryd were before.

25. Stukov is awesome in StarCraft 2. Very well written, well presented, well played. In Brood War, we never really saw Stukov really die. And there was a story presented, describing what happened to him. I would his presence anything BUT shitty. It's like certain other character in Legacy of the Void. Bringing someone back in some form itself is not bad, if you do something with it. This is a great example of that.

26. It's more simple to say "We were once enemies", than describe entire Brood War. Of course, it may be a plot-hole.

27. Rashagal was not infested but mind controlled. There is difference. And there is reason the plans for infested Protoss were scrapped. Protoss were never able to be infested. That was the whole point of getting Kerrigan in SC1 - Overmind wanted to have a powerfull individual it could control, that would be able to match psionic powers of Protoss, as it could not just infest them. That is in StarCraft 1. It's as far from retcon as you can get.

28. In Brood War itself it was pointed out, that Duran was not human at all. That was the point - he was not terran in any way. You know, glowing red eyes and distorted voice, ability to pose as infested Terran. It never crossed my mind that he could by Terran in the slightest. And about the name being reversed - that is a common trope in fiction. Don't see any problem here.

29. So they should give him purple energy? Or pink to appease to your "adult" tastes? Really, that is the problem? I guess that proves that Star Wars, Lord of the Rings, StarCraft, WarCraft, and like majority of fiction is just childish. You know that colors have a lot to do with overall presentation of any given character, right? And it affect your perception. That is the reason Khalai Protoss have blue color scheme, and Dark Templar have green and dark color scheme. This is not nitpicking. This is pointing into some line of dialogue and saying "I don't like this font. 1/10 game". And it didn't make sense to get rid of Mengsk. Why do it? How could it advance Amon's plans? They cared only for the hybrid, nothing else. You do also realise that shapeshifter cannot be in two places at once? He would have to play many roles and still work his ass off to create the hybrid. Not in any way reasonable.

30. In WoL Tal'Darim were different from the ones we see in HoTS. It was a retconn, plain and simple. And a good one, cause new Tal'Darim are awesome.

31. I enjoyed entirety of SC2 gameplay more than Brood War, or SC1. Just taste.

32. Gamplay and story segregation. Plot-hole definiately, not a big one though.

33. A required situtaion. She does not care for them. It's not a good choice, but it makes sense form her perspective.

34. A plot-hole. Or it's not his gun per se.

35. After getting Raynor back Kerrigan shifts a little into more human side, which makes perfect sense. Also, those guys on prison ship were... well... prisoners. Could be political, but they could be just evil. And as I said - those civilians will not drop Golden Armada on her ass if she lets them go.

35.2. Mengsk killed Tarsonis. That in itself is a horrible act. Not mentioning all the other stuff he did on his way to power. Queen of Blades herself was horrible monster, but she was not Kerrigan.

36. It is pretty much explained in Legacy. Artifact can manipulate and store various type of energies, primary Void ones. Mengsk just modified it to target Kerrigan herself. Raynor modyfied it to get the Void energies of the Zerg. Protoss modyfied it to store Void energies of Amon. Yes, kinda a deus ex machina, but I have seen worse. And it makes a cool cutscene, so I am willing to let go of this one.

37. So what should happen to Mengsk? I don't get the argument.

38. If you notice, in the background we see entire swarm be brought back into Leviathan. Probably some pionic-based way of calling back the troops. And it makes a cool cutscene.


I don't get all this hate on SC2. I really don't. It's the same as with Force Awakenes, or new Final Fantasies. Many people just point literally at anything and say "It sucks". Some of your arguments make sense, but for the most part it's just nitpicking and literally stating opinions, that are quite harsh. I agree that HoTS is the worst of SC2 trilogy, but it is nowhere near as bad as some other games. It's not Top 20 material, but a Top 100, like in the nineties? Yeah, sure. It is like BvS. It's not bad, it has a lot of good points, the problem lies in problematic development of it, and some of the presentation. Still a good game though.

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Formosan1 wrote:1. You state opinion that the conversation is forced and melodramatic, but please be more specific. In my opinion it was definiately dramatic, but forced? Not really. I think it makes full sense that Kerrigan wants Mengsk dead. Even more so than Raynor does. Arch covered this in his lorerun.
Here's the problem as I see it. According to the story Kerrigan has no memories of her time as the queen on blades. I believe that anyone else in that situation would be confused more than anything else, you'd think that waking up one day and finding out you've murdered 8 billion people whould be more of a concern then getting revenge. Now if it where a situation where Kerrigan was fully aware of her actions but had no control over her body, then yes that would make more sense. But aside from that it's completely pointless, because if Kerrigan had told Jim that she was just going to run off with him and that's it, Mengsk was till going to try to have her assassinated and declare publicly that Raynor was dead, but at least it would have made her a more sympathetic character. Instead she comes across like Anakin Skywalker in episode 2. If they wanted to turn Kerrigan back into a hero, which I think was a mistake to begin with, they could have at least done it right.

2. She does it to make a point. Remember, she saw Zerg invasion on Tarsonis with her own eyes, and she does have certain flashes of the past as Queen of Blades. Even though she was not really there for the most part of the story, she does know Zerg better than anyone. And she better then anyone knows what ends up happening, when someone in position of power tries to experiment/or play with the Zerg. She definiately does not want it to repeat with Valerian.
Again no she doesn't. We are told several times that she doesn't remember her time as the Queen of Blades.

3. Kerrigan is no longer really human. Her psychic abilities have been much more powerfull after transformation into Queen of Blades. Her retaining some percentage of her old power makes sense, considering she still has some alien DNA in her body. The fact noone says it flat out does not make it a plot-hole.
Yes it does. Because the whole point of Wings of Liberty was to turn Kerrigan back into a human, presumably back to how she was originally and considering how uch of a change it is, you need to inform the audience about it. Otherwise it's your personal interpretation, you have no proof/example to back up that theory.

4. Do you really think any covert assasin would have any chances against Kerrigan and Raynor? Really? That's one thing. The other is - again, something Arch covered - Mengsk is breaking at this point. He is afraid of Kerrigan and Raynor and is slowly devolving, focusing his efforts just on killing her with his full force. If you recall, he sent Nova to get Kerrigan. That is literally her level of power and skill as a ghost. So... yeah, it makes sense.
It isn't a matter of whether or not his soldiers are capable. You don't send an army to assassinate one person, ever. You either send a specialist or a small squad. Hell it's not as if Tychus or Tosh had any problem getting close to Raynor were they could have killed them. But fine, Mengsks has gone cuckoo for cocoa puffs. I've always felt that Mengsks portrayal in SC2 was a ruination of his character.  

5. She sounds as someone unstable. Although I would not place it as a specific point here, as it is purely opinion.

6. Well, lifting someone for a few seconds or tossing them with full force is different from slowly carrying them across a large space. We don't know how big the space between them is, we can only assume Kerrigan was not able to use her power on such a large distance.
He's wearing power armor, he would have been fine. She could have at least tried and it's literally the next scene that we see her doing it on the Hyperion.

7. Valerian wanted to make sure, that Kerrigan is no longer the threat, that's why he made all the tests. Raynor and others stayed... well, i don't think I have to explain why. Afterward, he probably was not feeling confident enough in just returning to Korhal. And Mengsk couldn't just denounce him, as it would undermine family name.
Again your lore crafting with nothing to back your theory up and you point about Mengsk not denouncing Valerian. I thought we just established that Mengsk was turning crazy, why would he care.

8. You clearly look for plot-holes where there are none. It was made a specific point that Kerrigan DOES NOT WANT to control the Zerg. She despises them. She used them only, because that was the only real thing to do for her. You DO realise, that people not always use all their strengh and power even when they need to? The fact that you have a gun does not mean you shoot everyone. This is such situation.
The first mission of the game was Kerrigan using the zerg to ramage through Valerian's lab to "proof a point" but when lives are at stake, specifically hers and Raynors. Now she's reluctant? Please explain how that makes sense.

9. All was covered in lorerun. Raynor with Kerrigan became much more of a direct threat, especially with Valerian helping him out. Him becoming a martyr was secondary objective. Considering Zerg threat was over, people were not caring for one rebel. It's just how it works.
"Except that, at this point Raynor is as much of a threat as he was before the start of Wings of Liberty, and Mengsk didn't feel the need to kill him back then either, and we just discussed how Valerain helping Raynor made no sense, and if Mengsk wanted to use Raynor as bait or a bargaining chip, he could have just announced that he's been arrested. The only reason that Raynor was declared dead, was so Kerrigan would become the zerg queen again and that is bad story telling.

10. It was made a point, that Protoss discovered her presence. She needed to kill them, so that Golden Armada would not butcher her ass. That is clearly presented in game. Pay attention.
I did pay attention. She could have just left. Kerrigan has a line when she finds Niadra's body, were she talks about making the Protoss pay. Why? If her plan was to just use the zerg as a weapon against Mengsk, why did she take Niadra's death personally.

11. Do you really think that Golden Armada would just arrive, not notice Kerrigan and say "Oh fine, Queen of Blades is not here, chills". They would pursue her. And - as Arch made a point - she was really broken at this point. She just didn't think rationally. It makes sense for her to be acting like that. It doesn't take a sociopath to be brutal - although being sociopath makes a lot of real-life sense for both Raynor and Kerrigan, so shrug.
Again you don't use a fleet to find one person. If the Golden Armada went to Kaldir and Kerrigan had left, what would they have done exactly? Were they going to attack every world within that system to find her? and after doing that and not finding her how exactly would they have tracked her down?

12. Two options - either she was told offscreen who Zeratul is, or it is a plot-hole as team did not have time to flesh it out. A plot-hole if you ask me.
Hallelujah. We agree on something.

13. How does that ruin his character? And how is this a nonsense, considering all that he knows? Hell, it makes sense that a proud Protoss would be a little off after learning all of this.
It doesn't ruin his character, his character was crap to begin with, my opinion obviously.
However lets focus on the actual point I was making. I understand that the units are not to scale in game. Regular Battlecruisers being city sized and all. Now in game the Gorgon Battlecruiser is nearly three times larger then a battlecruiser. Warfield continuously sends one after the other dispite the fact that Kerrigan keeps blowing them up, costing god knows how much in resources and personal. Warfield has the military command skills of Zapp Brannigan "You see, Killbots have a preset kill limit. Knowing their weakness, I sent wave after wave of my own men at them, until they reached their limit and shut down."  


14. Calling Mengsk cartoonish is dumb. Nothing else to say, he was just as evil and stupid in StarCraft 1. And case of Warfield I would not treat with such a butthurt. It's difficult to write a good strategist, if you don't have real knowledge on tactis. I myself love warfare in fiction and studying it in real life, and still I am terrible in writing genius strategist. Thrawn was an exception by being actually smart tactical genius in lore and in action.
Mengsk was a better written character in sc1, nothing else to say. Oh and Warfield didn't need to be a Thrawn level military genius, he just needed to be somewhat competent.

15. He mentioned Raynor. She felt guilty. Pay attention. And what more - those few wounded man would not call Golden Armada.
Funny that she doesn't think of Raynor or of her own experiences when she orders her Broodmothers to invade whole worlds with god knows how many Dominion civilians. Just because she tells Valerian that she won't attack Korhal's civilian sectors at the very end, it doesn't make her a hero.

16. Again, you look for plot-holes where there are none. I myself have been in situations, where I was not really myself (being drung, or high for example, or both) and acted not like me. I had no control over what I was doing, still I felt guilty cause of my actions. It is called conscience.
Again, it seems like her conscience was making her feel bad for not having killed more people.

17. The very fact someone is under control does not make them a mook. You just insulted Darth Vader, Golbez, Kefka, and like a hundred other villains. And what's more important, Overmind being artificial construct... kinda makes sense if you think about it.
No because unlike Queen of Blades or the Overmind, Vader wasn't under mind control. Vader was in a position were if he stepped out of line the Emperor just personally kill him or turn the Empire on him, he knew he was in a no win position and had to work around it. But when a character is under mind control they have no agency, their motives become null and void, because they've turned into an extension of whoever is controlling them. A character, especially a villain is interesting because they are making the choice to be evil.
But like I explained in my Wings of Liberty review, turning the Overmind into a mind controlled tool of Amon does a disservice to the character, like Mengsk, and brings up a whole new batch of plot-holes and inconsistencies.  


18. Overmind did not need to... lie. He was imprisoned in his own mind. It's Borg effect. And as we know, Amon wanted to create hybrid from Protoss and Zerg. Protoss are much harder to control (by the time he created Overmind, Khala was not yet created). If Overmind was able to create hybrid by absorbing the Protoss, he would win immidiately. Had it failed, Protoss would be dead and Amon would have Zerg under his control, being able to freely create hyrbid on his own. Both are win scenarios for Amon. No problem here.
Except that we are told in all three games of sc2 that zerg and protoss dna can't be mixed except by Amon or Duran, so it's impossible for the Overmind to do, and if the Protoss are all dead then Amon wouldn't have any Protoss left to make hybrids out of, so he's fucked. This is what I was talking about earlier about plot-holes and inconsistencies.

19. Cause Amon didn't reveal himself? Creation doesn't have to know the creator to realise he is bad news. Mass Effect 1 had simmilar situation with
Spoiler:
Rachni knowing something evil controlled them, yet not knowing what exactly.
He didn't have to reveal himself. When his mind merged with the Overminds, he found out that the Xel'naga created the Overmind as an experiment and that the Overmind wanted to assimilate the protoss, if he was able to find all that out, why didn't he find out about Amon? Especially since the Overmind was "raging within it's own mind."

20. Overmind had to work around his mind. Arch covered it in his lorerun. He was like droid in Star Wars. Droids cannot work against their programming, but they can work around it. It made sense for Overmind to implant itself into Aiur, or to create Kerrigan. Queen of Blades still ended up wrong, cause Overmind had to design her in a way that would fit Amon's plans. Queen of Blades was also kinda independent, so he could not literally write all the important elements into her brain. The point is, she was supposed to have been a force that blocked Zerg from Hybrid. And it kinda worked. It just required her being freed to turn Zerg against Amon.
Except that the Overminds plan was to create the Queen of Blades as part of a roundabout plan to stop Amon, so creating the Queen of Blades was in itself going against Amon which he shouldn't have been able to do in the first place. And the only reason it worked was because the plot needed it to.

21. Nitpick and taste issues. It was a well presented moment in my opinion.

22. You changing into CinemaSins now?
Your sarcasm doesn't change the fact that it was an obvious plot twist.

23. She has no choice. Plain and simple. Also - those are marines. Military. Not harmless civilians that were on Tarsonis. Difference between Alderaan and Death Star.
She did have a choice. She could have just killed them instead of doing to them what the Overmind did to her, she acts like a sociopath.

24. Stukov briefly explains what hybrid are. I guess Kerrigan figured out the rest. I never got the impression she knew exactly what hybryd were before.
Alright fair enough. But then why does she believe him, when he says that Mengsk is capable of making Hybrids? When in the Kaldir story arch she learned that mixing Protoss and Zerg dna is impossible.

25. Stukov is awesome in StarCraft 2. Very well written, well presented, well played. In Brood War, we never really saw Stukov really die. And there was a story presented, describing what happened to him. I would his presence anything BUT shitty. It's like certain other character in Legacy of the Void. Bringing someone back in some form itself is not bad, if you do something with it. This is a great example of that.
We see his funeral, where he's lauched into space, and in sc2 all he does is delieve exposition to Kerrigan, how exactly does that make him an interesting character?

26. It's more simple to say "We were once enemies", than describe entire Brood War. Of course, it may be a plot-hole.
Most likely, all things considered.

27. Rashagal was not infested but mind controlled. There is difference. And there is reason the plans for infested Protoss were scrapped. Protoss were never able to be infested. That was the whole point of getting Kerrigan in SC1 - Overmind wanted to have a powerfull individual it could control, that would be able to match psionic powers of Protoss, as it could not just infest them. That is in StarCraft 1. It's as far from retcon as you can get.
When did she gain the ability to mind control people? why has it never been brought up again?
Blizzard had plans to make infested protoss units in Wings of Liberty until Mezten changed his mind at the last second, and if the Overmind wanted Kerrigan to fight the protoss then why did he leave her on Aiur, it's one way or the other you can't just flip flop charcter motivations whenever it's convenient to you.


28. In Brood War itself it was pointed out, that Duran was not human at all. That was the point - he was not terran in any way. You know, glowing red eyes and distorted voice, ability to pose as infested Terran. It never crossed my mind that he could by Terran in the slightest. And about the name being reversed - that is a common trope in fiction. Don't see any problem here.
I was making a point about how him being a shapeshifter created plot-holes.

29. So they should give him purple energy? Or pink to appease to your "adult" tastes? Really, that is the problem? I guess that proves that Star Wars, Lord of the Rings, StarCraft, WarCraft, and like majority of fiction is just childish. You know that colors have a lot to do with overall presentation of any given character, right? And it affect your perception. That is the reason Khalai Protoss have blue color scheme, and Dark Templar have green and dark color scheme. This is not nitpicking. This is pointing into some line of dialogue and saying "I don't like this font. 1/10 game". And it didn't make sense to get rid of Mengsk. Why do it? How could it advance Amon's plans? They cared only for the hybrid, nothing else. You do also realise that shapeshifter cannot be in two places at once? He would have to play many roles and still work his ass off to create the hybrid. Not in any way reasonable.
Maybe it's just me, but I seem to remember that in the mission before that cutscene they had establish Void energies being green.
You seriously don't see the advantage of Duran being in control of the Dominion?


30. In WoL Tal'Darim were different from the ones we see in HoTS. It was a retconn, plain and simple. And a good one, cause new Tal'Darim are awesome.

31. I enjoyed entirety of SC2 gameplay more than Brood War, or SC1. Just taste.

32. Gamplay and story segregation. Plot-hole definiately, not a big one though.

33. A required situtaion. She does not care for them. It's not a good choice, but it makes sense form her perspective.
As a sociopath, yes it does.

34. A plot-hole. Or it's not his gun per se.

35. After getting Raynor back Kerrigan shifts a little into more human side, which makes perfect sense. Also, those guys on prison ship were... well... prisoners. Could be political, but they could be just evil. And as I said - those civilians will not drop Golden Armada on her ass if she lets them go.
Why do you keep bring up the Golden Armada, the point I'm making is how the writing makes her come across as a hypocrite.

35.2. Mengsk killed Tarsonis. That in itself is a horrible act. Not mentioning all the other stuff he did on his way to power. Queen of Blades herself was horrible monster, but she was not Kerrigan.
Primal Zerg Kerrigan, sends broodmothers to invade terran worlds. Hypocrite.

36. It is pretty much explained in Legacy. Artifact can manipulate and store various type of energies, primary Void ones. Mengsk just modified it to target Kerrigan herself. Raynor modyfied it to get the Void energies of the Zerg. Protoss modyfied it to store Void energies of Amon. Yes, kinda a deus ex machina, but I have seen worse. And it makes a cool cutscene, so I am willing to let go of this one.
Except originally, it was supose to be an implant in her neck that Mengsk had planted there, you can find the original production video that was leaked, but every body hated the ending and they changed it to have the artifact instead, so literally when they didn't intend to use it again they shoved it in because they could come up with anything better.

37. So what should happen to Mengsk? I don't get the argument.
She stabs him, tear his heart out, throw him off the building. Anything less Michal Bay level of stupid.

38. If you notice, in the background we see entire swarm be brought back into Leviathan. Probably some pionic-based way of calling back the troops. And it makes a cool cutscene.
I know that there are flying zerg. I said specificlly how did Kerrigan spontanisously learn to fly?



I don't get all this hate on SC2. I really don't. It's the same as with Force Awakenes, or new Final Fantasies. Many people just point literally at anything and say "It sucks". Some of your arguments make sense, but for the most part it's just nitpicking and literally stating opinions, that are quite harsh. I agree that HoTS is the worst of SC2 trilogy, but it is nowhere near as bad as some other games. It's not Top 20 material, but a Top 100, like in the nineties? Yeah, sure. It is like BvS. It's not bad, it has a lot of good points, the problem lies in problematic development of it, and some of the presentation. Still a good game though.
Well there are plenty of people who'll accept whatever is giving to them without caring about the details, the only thing that SC2 does well is gameplay, the story, what I care about in a game is either horribly thought out or just generic to the point of being boring, and just because you don't understand or don't care about the problems this game has, doesn't mean they don't exist.

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1. The only reason Mengsk betrayed Kerrigan, was to have her turned into Queen of Blades. A bad writing? This is the same. Kerrigan wanting to kill Mengsk and not wanting to immidaitely run off - keep in mind, that tests were still going on during the attack - makes perfect sense. Kerrigan identifies all the deaths that she brought as Mengsk's just as her's. Therefore, she has much more hatred towards him.

2. Even if she didn't remember - or told so - she still knew how dangerous Zerg are more then anyone on Umosia, or Valerian himself.

3. In writing there is something like "unreliable narrator". The fact, that someone tells you something, does not immidiately makes it true. It was never told, that "Artifact will work 100%, we tested it etc etc". From the very beginning, it was a Xel'Naga technology, that they interpreted to work this way. It makes perfect sense, that something didn't work. Her hair is visual way of telling that to us - she is not really human, the artifact didn't work as intended. It's showing it, not telling. Not a plot-hole in light years.

4. Mengsk in StarCraft 2 is just as evil and manipulative as previously. He makes perfect sense. People not always make decisions that make sens. And Mengsk did exactly that in Starcraft 1 itself. And he was winning then. If that doesn't justify him not making good decisions when his enemies are at their strongest for years, then I don't know what could. Mengsk sending an army is making a point - he doesn't care about recources or people. He wants Raynor and Kerrigan dead. Nothing else matters to him. That's the point. And Raynor meeting Tosh or Tychus happened in completely different environment. Mengsk didn't have any chances of sending some disguised assasin into a top military, foreign installation - especially when Kerrigan is most important person in the sector. It's like saying, that it would be simple for Kerrigan, to just assassinate Mengsk. No, it's not.

6. Ok, she should at least try. Still, it's not a gigantic plot-hole, as it can be easily pointed as a rushed decision on character's part.

7. What lore-backing do you theories have? Until now, you actually stated something against well-estabilished lore. And I said it - probably. It's left for interpretation. Writers not always do, or even should tell us everything. It makes sense that Valerian escaped with Hyperion, or that he stayed in Umosia. It makes no less sense, then Mengsk just leaving Kerrigan on Tarsonis, or not trying to plead with Raynor.

8. She allowed herself to control the Zerg to stop anyone from trying to use them themselfs. And it was stated, that Valerian could purge entire place if he wanted to. Safe or not, they had SOME control of the situation. And again - she did not want anything to do with the Zerg. They are still beasts to her. Again, that's the same thing - the reason you shoot some moving animal to prove that weapons are dangerous does not make you immidiately use that very same gun against burglars, as the very point of using that gun on a animal, was to prove how dangerous it is to even TRY to control it. Her controling the Zerg would be exactly against what she tried to do in a lab. That would be hypocritical.

9. Hmm. Alright - I admit in this specific situation, I quoted Arch improperly. And I agree - that is not a great storytelling device. However, I will say, that I don't think that is such a big plot-hole. Mengsk felt like he had won at this point, so he acted rashly. Even if killing him was a wise decision - and you could argue, that at that point killing Raynor would actually be more profitable, as DESPITE Mengsk actions, he still became bigger threat, proving Mengsk tactic's to be kinda... inaccurate. And, he could just be trying to regain power, by making a statement, that EVERY danger he had faced till this point is gone. HOWEVER, I do think not contacting Kerrigan was a stupid action on his part, I can freely admit that.

10. Ok, the very fact she wanted to attack Protoss based on Niadra's death kinda doesn't make sense. I will "defend" her murdering the Protoss later, but attacking them? Yeah, that was kinda dumb strategic move and didn't really make sense based on her relationship with the Zerg. It would be far more sense-making, if she was found and attacked by the Protoss in the actual game. Any malice towards them makes no sense.

11. The thing is Kerrigan is not just one person. If Protoss found out that she was on a path to become Queen of Blades yet again, then she would not be ONE PERSON, but a head of the Swarm - making her single-most dangerous thing in the Korpulu sector. They would definiately go to Char, probably destroying all the known Zerg worlds, before Kerrigan would unite her forces. Granted, I doubt Artanis would just go on rampage throughout the entire sector. However, Kerrigan doesn't know the Protoss the way we do. She probably remembers them just murdering and glassing planets. Her not having idea previous to this makes sense, just how her actually learning more about them later does make sense as well. So I do not treat this part of the story as a plot-hole, or something out of character.

13. In Wings of Liberty Warfield actually did make sense as a commander. He was actually a nice contrast to Duke. He seemed to me like more idealistic version of Rommel, or smarter Pellaeon, if you ask me. However, I will agree, that his tactics weren't really that smart from lore-standpoint. Sending different ships, or using different tactics would make more sense.

14. Mengsk was not written "better" in any way in SC1. What we see him is a natural extension of character of this type. I enjoyed him in SC2 just as much as in SC1. About Warfield - in SC1 he seemed competent. In SC2 I admit, his tactics were kinda dumb, not denying that.

15. Well, attacking just Dominion military outposts or strategic installations, that made sense. All the attacks that ended up hurting civilians - that would make sense in early part of the game, were Kerrigan is gone. Later in the game, her sparing civilians and listening to Valerian made perfect sense - she regained her senses. And remember - she did not just randomly remember Raynor, Warfield mentioned him. It's rescuing Raynor and learning everything about Zerg was what really turned her back. Yes, it does not make her a hero, but it wasn't about being hero. It was more of a redemption/reganing yourself type of story. It was a reflection of an arc that Zerg came through.

16. Mentioning Raynor did make her feel guilty. It was not enough to make her stop, which was the point - Kerrigan was so focused on killing Mengsk, that even though she in her heart knew that what she had been doing had been wrong, however, she could not just stop.

17. No, it doesn't make them null, or void. They are just not really villains anymore. Mengsk is still a bastard, the same way he was previously. He is not a pawn in any way. Overmind was never evil, so it having some more motivations to him and a little tragic element does not reduce him in any way in my eyes. The same goes for Queen of Blades. She wasn't just a puppet. She was literally like Death Knight Arthas - still evil, still awesome, still it's own being, but seperate from main character, giving us one less Blizzard corruption story.

18. Well, we don't really know if Overmind could succeed itself creating some sort of hybrid - it didn't really get chance to try. Remember - for all we know, Duran started really acting AFTER Overmind died. My theory? Overmind was supposed to absorb Protoss and it's death forced Duran to move in personally and use all resources at his disposal. It just makes sense, that if Amon installed directive in Overmind to destroy and absorb the Protoss, he thought that he would succeed.

19. Amon was the Xel'Naga. Legacy cleares this pretty much - Amon was the only real Xel'Naga both Protoss or Zerg encountered. So it's not like Overmind didn't recognise Amon - he was the first Xel'Naga it encountered. Then, it was sent against Xel'Naga and Amon lost his body. It's a retcon, but I don't mind it.

20. Again, it is simmilar situation to a droid. Ever played Kotor 2? It has really simmilar situation with one of the droids. The thing is, Overmind justified the creation of Queen of Blades. It could not actively work against Amon, but it could work around his orders, by doing things that can work both for and against him depending on the situation. It's like learning to lie by convincing yourself that you are speaking truth, although you know the truth is different.

22. Something being predictable is not itself a negative in any way. They never went out of their way to tell that Jim was dead, and although I DO treat all that stuff in a slightly negative way, the very fact he survived is not anything really wrong in itself. Don't mind the sarcasm, I like to joke a little even in serious situations. Helps to deal with them.

23. She did have a choice overall, I agree. But I will say, that at that point, infesting those people is a horrible, yet from Zerg perspective, a correct choice. Kinda. Granted, I would prefer if infesting prisoners wasn't in the game. The platform and infesting entire army was already a horrible situation on it's own - like releasing xenomorph's to kill some Weyland Yutani guys. Effective, but... damn, that is truly cruel.

24. Infesting Protoss is impossible. Taking the zerg retrovirus and using it to infest and mutate Protoss is what is impossible. The hybrid are different - they are not bred, nor infested. They are engineered. It's like in real life - creatures that can't have offspring can be spliced in some way. Add to it the fact that hybrid are not bred, but cloned, hinting that they are sterile.

25. He is someone who has nothing to loose. Like Kerrigan he basicly cares only for revenge, but working with the Swarm kinda gives him purpose. This way, he mirrors her arc. Add to it the fact, that he does miss his past life and there is this grief and sadness in the background of his character. His arc is small, but it is there and it is used as a mirror to Kerrigan herself, adding to overall game's themes. And his presentation is enjoyable, just as much as acting is. Granted, I have not played, or watched the game in a long time, and I really did that only once truly, so I some small details may have slipped.

27. That is the point - Overmind justified creation of Kerrigan, but left her, cause it knew that it would probably die. It's the same thing, working around his programming. That Arch covered in a lorerun Very Happy About the mind-control... well, it would be more of a plot-hole in Brood War, than HoTS. Mind control is kinda brought up in StarCraft sometimes, it's just never explained - which borders with plot-hole are though. It never really popped up in my mind though, I will have to look it up. It usueally works against weak-willed, or old creatures, and is utilized by powerfull psionics. Kerrigan was the later and I do recall Raszagal was hinted to be the former. I may be wrong about this, so care to correct me.

28. I don't think so. One of adventages of being a shape-shifter, is being invisible. You are not recognised in any way. So Narud not over-using his shapeshifting - and as we all know, his plans work without doing it - is not really any real plot-hole. As I said, having a gun doesn't mean you should always use it.

29. It was already well estabilished, that void energies were green. It is obvious that it is just a visual effect there. Don't mind it though that much. It kinda stood out in HoTS, worked in Legacy.

35. It's not being hipocritical. That is the point of Kaldir - after initial clash, she worked her ass off to kill all the Protoss to prevent Golden Armada from attacking her. That threat was not there in case of Dominion civilians, or wounded men.

35.2 I will agree, destroying civilian worlds doesn't make sense with her. But attacking military installations, or those along those lines kinda makes sense. Granted, I would prefer that not being in game at all and Kerrigan just gathering her forces, or Swarm just having more and more units along the line and being much more powerfull.

36. Well, writers changing something does not really make the situation that bad. And her having an implant in the neck would not make any sense at all - Mengsk would just detonate it (unless it was not there all the time). Artifact was implied to be there in game at least in one cutscene. As I said - I do admit it kinda is deus ex machina in HoTS. But I am ready to let it go, as tthe pay-off is very good.

37. I don't know, I got idea that is what she wanted to do in the beginning. She changed her mind to blow him up later. Explosions themselfs don't make a Michael Bay effect though..

38. I said the Entire Swarm. All of it - Zerglins, Ultralisks, Hydralisks. As I said, it's not explained it's just showed. But you don't really have to explain every move anime-style. And it makes for a cool scene, so I don't mind that much.

I am not accepting anything anyone gives to me. I am actually really critical in my approach. It's just that I am more willing to let go of the bad stuff and enjoy the good, after my overall enjoyment. Granted, I don't think HoTS has amazing storyline, or anything along those lines. It's a definite net-positive, but probably the worst of SC games. Not bad, just has too many plot-holes and problems in it's narrative.

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[quote="Formosan1"]1. The only reason Mengsk betrayed Kerrigan, was to have her turned into Queen of Blades. A bad writing? This is the same. Kerrigan wanting to kill Mengsk and not wanting to immidaitely run off - keep in mind, that tests were still going on during the attack - makes perfect sense. Kerrigan identifies all the deaths that she brought as Mengsk's just as her's. Therefore, she has much more hatred towards him.
No. Mengsk left her on Tarsonis because at that point he already won. Why would be waste more of his troops trying to save her, when he didn't need her anymore? And don't forget, it wasn't just her, but an entire strike team that Mengsk left to die. We learned what lengths Mengsk was willing to go to to win, and in that scene we see how ruthless he is. It wasn't only step up for Kerrigan to become infested.

2. Even if she didn't remember - or told so - she still knew how dangerous Zerg are more then anyone on Umosia, or Valerian himself.
How? That doesn't make any sense. If she doesn't remember anything how can she know how dangerous they are? It's a direct contradiction.

3. In writing there is something like "unreliable narrator". The fact, that someone tells you something, does not immidiately makes it true. It was never told, that "Artifact will work 100%, we tested it etc etc". From the very beginning, it was a Xel'Naga technology, that they interpreted to work this way. It makes perfect sense, that something didn't work. Her hair is visual way of telling that to us - she is not really human, the artifact didn't work as intended. It's showing it, not telling. Not a plot-hole in light years.
However Metzen took the extra step of retconning Kerrigan into being the power terran psychic of all time, in lore. So side from being able to control zerg, we now have no idea what powers she gained after becoming deinfested, especially since her abilities as a hero unit aren't zerg related.
No matter what story telling tools you use, if you don't use them well it becomes determent to the work as a whole.
Besides that, my opinion is that it was a mistake to take the story in this direction in the first place and turn kerriagn into a "hero". It's not as if Blizzard themselves haven't done that a dozen times already.


4. Mengsk in StarCraft 2 is just as evil and manipulative as previously. He makes perfect sense. People not always make decisions that make sens. And Mengsk did exactly that in Starcraft 1 itself. And he was winning then. If that doesn't justify him not making good decisions when his enemies are at their strongest for years, then I don't know what could. Mengsk sending an army is making a point - he doesn't care about recources or people. He wants Raynor and Kerrigan dead. Nothing else matters to him. That's the point. And Raynor meeting Tosh or Tychus happened in completely different environment. Mengsk didn't have any chances of sending some disguised assasin into a top military, foreign installation - especially when Kerrigan is most important person in the sector. It's like saying, that it would be simple for Kerrigan, to just assassinate Mengsk. No, it's not.
Remember that kill switch that was going to be implanted in her neck that was suppose to be part of the games original ending?
That implant was going to be place on her while she was in the Umojan labs. Which means Mengsk either had someone on the inside. Which still wouldn't have made sense because why wouldn't they have just killed her then and there.
Which is more prove that the people writting the story were either shortsighted or just didn't care.
As for Mengsk you think he was portrayed the same as in StarCraft 1, I don't.


6. Ok, she should at least try. Still, it's not a gigantic plot-hole, as it can be easily pointed as a rushed decision on character's part.
After the Archangel was destroyed all she had to do was call Raynor back or all Blizzard had to do was dump some debris in Raynors path or had him captured during the fight, simple fixes, but Blizzard cares more for gameplay than story.

7. What lore-backing do you theories have? Until now, you actually stated something against well-estabilished lore. And I said it - probably. It's left for interpretation. Writers not always do, or even should tell us everything. It makes sense that Valerian escaped with Hyperion, or that he stayed in Umosia. It makes no less sense, then Mengsk just leaving Kerrigan on Tarsonis, or not trying to plead with Raynor.
How does it make sense that Valerian would help Raynor and Kerrigan when his stated goal is that he wants to be Emperor? Everything he does on Umoja puts everything he's worked on at risk. It's confusing in a story when you don't understand a characters basic motivation.
Example: Mengsk wants to overthrow the confederacy.
He plans to us the zerg to destroy them, showing a lack of empathy for human lives.
So when he leaves Kerrigan, we already understand that he's going to become a tyrant.
Simple.


8. She allowed herself to control the Zerg to stop anyone from trying to use them themselfs. And it was stated, that Valerian could purge entire place if he wanted to. Safe or not, they had SOME control of the situation. And again - she did not want anything to do with the Zerg. They are still beasts to her. Again, that's the same thing - the reason you shoot some moving animal to prove that weapons are dangerous does not make you immidiately use that very same gun against burglars, as the very point of using that gun on a animal, was to prove how dangerous it is to even TRY to control it. Her controling the Zerg would be exactly against what she tried to do in a lab. That would be hypocritical.
Except that she says that she "shouldn't control the zerg again" not that she doesn't want to, but that she shouldn't.

9. Hmm. Alright - I admit in this specific situation, I quoted Arch improperly. And I agree - that is not a great storytelling device. However, I will say, that I don't think that is such a big plot-hole. Mengsk felt like he had won at this point, so he acted rashly. Even if killing him was a wise decision - and you could argue, that at that point killing Raynor would actually be more profitable, as DESPITE Mengsk actions, he still became bigger threat, proving Mengsk tactic's to be kinda... inaccurate. And, he could just be trying to regain power, by making a statement, that EVERY danger he had faced till this point is gone. HOWEVER, I do think not contacting Kerrigan was a stupid action on his part, I can freely admit that.

10. Ok, the very fact she wanted to attack Protoss based on Niadra's death kinda doesn't make sense. I will "defend" her murdering the Protoss later, but attacking them? Yeah, that was kinda dumb strategic move and didn't really make sense based on her relationship with the Zerg. It would be far more sense-making, if she was found and attacked by the Protoss in the actual game. Any malice towards them makes no sense.

11. The thing is Kerrigan is not just one person. If Protoss found out that she was on a path to become Queen of Blades yet again, then she would not be ONE PERSON, but a head of the Swarm - making her single-most dangerous thing in the Korpulu sector. They would definiately go to Char, probably destroying all the known Zerg worlds, before Kerrigan would unite her forces. Granted, I doubt Artanis would just go on rampage throughout the entire sector. However, Kerrigan doesn't know the Protoss the way we do. She probably remembers them just murdering and glassing planets. Her not having idea previous to this makes sense, just how her actually learning more about them later does make sense as well. So I do not treat this part of the story as a plot-hole, or something out of character.
Would she have cared? All Kerrigan wants at this point is to kill Mengsk.

13. In Wings of Liberty Warfield actually did make sense as a commander. He was actually a nice contrast to Duke. He seemed to me like more idealistic version of Rommel, or smarter Pellaeon, if you ask me. However, I will agree, that his tactics weren't really that smart from lore-standpoint. Sending different ships, or using different tactics would make more sense.
In Wings of Liberty, during the Shatter the Sky mission, Duke points out that nukes wouldn't work on the space platform because the zerg are burrowed beneath the surface. So his brilliant plan was to send units to destroy coolant towers that are on the surface instead. He is written like a goddam moron.

14. Mengsk was not written "better" in any way in SC1. What we see him is a natural extension of character of this type. I enjoyed him in SC2 just as much as in SC1. About Warfield - in SC1 he seemed competent. In SC2 I admit, his tactics were kinda dumb, not denying that.
Again you say he was the same in sc2. I don't.

15. Well, attacking just Dominion military outposts or strategic installations, that made sense. All the attacks that ended up hurting civilians - that would make sense in early part of the game, were Kerrigan is gone. Later in the game, her sparing civilians and listening to Valerian made perfect sense - she regained her senses. And remember - she did not just randomly remember Raynor, Warfield mentioned him. It's rescuing Raynor and learning everything about Zerg was what really turned her back. Yes, it does not make her a hero, but it wasn't about being hero. It was more of a redemption/reganing yourself type of story. It was a reflection of an arc that Zerg came through.
Except that right before Korhal she's still sending broodmother to attack worlds. And If all she was doing was killing Dominion soldiers and there happened to be casualties, fine. But she's going around infesting people, that is just a hideous thing for a character that wants redemption to do.

16. Mentioning Raynor did make her feel guilty. It was not enough to make her stop, which was the point - Kerrigan was so focused on killing Mengsk, that even though she in her heart knew that what she had been doing had been wrong, however, she could not just stop.
Again she doesn't stop at killing people, she's infesting whole worlds.

17. No, it doesn't make them null, or void. They are just not really villains anymore. Mengsk is still a bastard, the same way he was previously. He is not a pawn in any way. Overmind was never evil, so it having some more motivations to him and a little tragic element does not reduce him in any way in my eyes. The same goes for Queen of Blades. She wasn't just a puppet. She was literally like Death Knight Arthas - still evil, still awesome, still it's own being, but seperate from main character, giving us one less Blizzard corruption story.
-I never mentioned Mengsk.
-The blame for why the Overmind and Kerrigan were evil is now shifted to Amon, it's taking away the original motivations of the characters.


18. Well, we don't really know if Overmind could succeed itself creating some sort of hybrid - it didn't really get chance to try. Remember - for all we know, Duran started really acting AFTER Overmind died. My theory? Overmind was supposed to absorb Protoss and it's death forced Duran to move in personally and use all resources at his disposal. It just makes sense, that if Amon installed directive in Overmind to destroy and absorb the Protoss, he thought that he would succeed.
(Wings of Liberty, Tassadar/Oros: "A single over-riding purpose was forced upon them: the destruction of our people." destroy not assimilate.
Add to that the retcon that Zerg can't infest protoss dna. Only the Xel'Naga can.


19. Amon was the Xel'Naga. Legacy cleares this pretty much - Amon was the only real Xel'Naga both Protoss or Zerg encountered. So it's not like Overmind didn't recognise Amon - he was the first Xel'Naga it encountered. Then, it was sent against Xel'Naga and Amon lost his body. It's a retcon, but I don't mind it.
Exactly it's a retcon, you may not care. But people like myself do because we liked that the Overmind was acting of it's own nature and not that it was a pawn of Amon.

23. She did have a choice overall, I agree. But I will say, that at that point, infesting those people is a horrible, yet from Zerg perspective, a correct choice. Kinda. Granted, I would prefer if infesting prisoners wasn't in the game. The platform and infesting entire army was already a horrible situation on it's own - like releasing xenomorph's to kill some Weyland Yutani guys. Effective, but... damn, that is truly cruel.
Except she isn't zerg, Kerrigan entire story act with Zagara is Zagara telling Kerrigan how a zerg would do things and Kerrigan saying no.

25. He is someone who has nothing to loose. Like Kerrigan he basicly cares only for revenge, but working with the Swarm kinda gives him purpose. This way, he mirrors her arc. Add to it the fact, that he does miss his past life and there is this grief and sadness in the background of his character. His arc is small, but it is there and it is used as a mirror to Kerrigan herself, adding to overall game's themes. And his presentation is enjoyable, just as much as acting is. Granted, I have not played, or watched the game in a long time, and I really did that only once truly, so I some small details may have slipped.
My point was that he should never have been brought back to like in the first place.

27. That is the point - Overmind justified creation of Kerrigan, but left her, cause it knew that it would probably die. It's the same thing, working around his programming. That Arch covered in a lorerun Very Happy About the mind-control... well, it would be more of a plot-hole in Brood War, than HoTS. Mind control is kinda brought up in StarCraft sometimes, it's just never explained - which borders with plot-hole are though. It never really popped up in my mind though, I will have to look it up. It usueally works against weak-willed, or old creatures, and is utilized by powerfull psionics. Kerrigan was the later and I do recall Raszagal was hinted to be the former. I may be wrong about this, so care to correct me.
My reasoning during Brood Wars was that people can be infested and not look like zerg outwardly. Case in point, when Duran switchs to working with Kerrigan he has the same portrait during the zerg briefing scenes that he had during the terran campaign, it didn't change like Kerrigans did in sc1, and since the retcon that protoss are immune to infestation wasn't around at that time, that's what made sense.

28. I don't think so. One of adventages of being a shape-shifter, is being invisible. You are not recognised in any way. So Narud not over-using his shapeshifting - and as we all know, his plans work without doing it - is not really any real plot-hole. As I said, having a gun doesn't mean you should always use it.
The problem I have is that if Duran was a shapeshifter from the beginning why wasn't that explained or shown in Brood Wars? and it opens up all kinds of questions about whether or not he can shift to look like a protoss or zerg. If you going to have a shapeshifter in a story don't waste the fact that he's a shapeshifter in the narrative.  

29. It was already well estabilished, that void energies were green. It is obvious that it is just a visual effect there. Don't mind it though that much. It kinda stood out in HoTS, worked in Legacy.
I Duran is using void energies then why did it turn red? More importantly why was there a Street Fighter fight between Kerrigan and Duran in a rts series that started off a sci-military opera? The entire run of sc2 feels like it was made for 13 year olds.

35. It's not being hipocritical. That is the point of Kaldir - after initial clash, she worked her ass off to kill all the Protoss to prevent Golden Armada from attacking her. That threat was not there in case of Dominion civilians, or wounded men.
"Infestaion."

35.2 I will agree, destroying civilian worlds doesn't make sense with her. But attacking military installations, or those along those lines kinda makes sense. Granted, I would prefer that not being in game at all and Kerrigan just gathering her forces, or Swarm just having more and more units along the line and being much more powerfull.

36. Well, writers changing something does not really make the situation that bad. And her having an implant in the neck would not make any sense at all - Mengsk would just detonate it (unless it was not there all the time). Artifact was implied to be there in game at least in one cutscene. As I said - I do admit it kinda is deus ex machina in HoTS. But I am ready to let it go, as tthe pay-off is very good.
But they didn't change the script because it was illogical, they changed the script because it was leaked and people hated it.

37. I don't know, I got idea that is what she wanted to do in the beginning. She changed her mind to blow him up later. Explosions themselfs don't make a Michael Bay effect though..
Explosions, no. Explosions that blow up an entire room to kill one old man,yes.

38. I said the Entire Swarm. All of it - Zerglins, Ultralisks, Hydralisks. As I said, it's not explained it's just showed. But you don't really have to explain every move anime-style. And it makes for a cool scene, so I don't mind that much.
Kerrigan has never been able to fly, ever. But now she can, so she can have a dramatic end? It makes no sense.

I am not accepting anything anyone gives to me. I am actually really critical in my approach. It's just that I am more willing to let go of the bad stuff and enjoy the good, after my overall enjoyment. Granted, I don't think HoTS has amazing storyline, or anything along those lines. It's a definite net-positive, but probably the worst of SC games. Not bad, just has too many plot-holes and problems in it's narrative.
Well I don't believe that starcraft 2 was good of even decent.
I thought it was completely mediocre at best. Add to that that I had eagerly waited 10 years to finally complete the story to my favorite rts series and this is what we got.
What I want is for StarCraft to be handled be a company that cares about the quality of not just their game mechanics but their stroy-telling too, and it's clearly not Blizzard.

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