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new FF7 remake details

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1 new FF7 remake details on Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:13 pm


thoughts? if this is the case I'll be avoiding this, at least that is my initial thoughts.

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2 Re: new FF7 remake details on Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:35 pm

Why is there so much negativity about the multi release? You wanted a FF7 remake, now you get 3 full length games about it :/

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3 Re: new FF7 remake details on Wed Apr 06, 2016 10:22 pm

it all depends on how it is handled, however calling FF7 midgar as a Full length game even if adding new gameplay/story elements to it, is not what I would consider a full length game when you compare it to other FF games, not to mention not knowing how many "full length" games this is going to be is another issue.

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4 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:49 am

I'm entirely with Luslanz on this one. And you know what? I'm happy that they're making FFVII Remake as big as the fans would want, without compromising by having the game be in development hell.

Consider how large FFXV is, and the fact that that took a decade to develop. Before you ask, yes, I'm fully aware of the issues that arose around the conflicting directions that Nomura was taking Versus XIII, and it is completely able to happen here as well. However, having FFVII Remake come out as one whole experience would also take years to develop, because FF is just that big nowadays, and people expect nothing less with regards to its production values. Personally, I don't want that sort of release schedule. I already did that song and dance with Versus/XV. I waited a decade. Rather, I'd be fine with one release every two years, just as happened with FFXIII and its sequels, or any other series that has regular installments. The only difference between most series and this, is that this has a concrete, planned end, because the storyline is already there. This can't really be milked very far due to that, and if someone is going to say that Square will just give us tiny bites of content as a response, then you're missing the point as to their whole mission objective anyway.

When it comes to part 1, I foresee us getting a far larger version of Midgar than the couple of sectors, reactors, slums, and the Shinra building that we got in the original game. Let's face it, the Midgar we're used to is tiny, even when you factor in what we saw in Crisis Core. However, Square has shown with FFXV that they can and will make very large fully-featured open-world environments, and given how expansive Midgar itself is in-universe, tweaking the story a bit in order to allow for exploration of the entire city is something I could see them doing to great effect. Of course, with that would come some actual stuff to DO in these locations, such as sidequests and maybe some minigames. As far as pricing goes? Well, AAA games these days range from anywhere between $40 and $60 USD, so I think a $40 pricetag for all of Midgar, the story we're used to, extra sidequests, etc. is actually a fair deal, especially when considering how story-heavy the Midgar section was compared to other chunks of the same length. Given a proportional amount of story, exploration, and side content in each installment, I could see the game taking place over the course of four to five installments.

Also, these girls were both really negative about the whole thing in general, which really rubbed me the wrong way. I get it, it's cool to hate on Square. It's been cool since...hell, forever, especially since FFXIII? But good god, people, listen to what you are saying. Have a bit of optimism about the situation, considering Square as a whole are actually turning themselves around ever since they gave Wada the boot. Or you know what? If you'd prefer to have the full experience at one time, just wait for it all to come out, like you would for any other game. Hell, that way you'd have people everywhere telling you if each installment is actually good or not, and can evaluate if the whole thing is worth your money.

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5 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:26 pm

just don't touch Tifa's boob size

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6 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:29 pm

K wrote:just don't touch Tifa's boob size

Square doesn't typically bow to SJWs, I think, and every single portrayal of her has had massive boobs (even Kingdom Hearts, surprisingly enough), so I doubt things will be different here.

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7 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:49 pm

K wrote:just don't touch Tifa's boob size
I thought they looked smaller in Advent Children Razz
@Samurai
ok my issue is not really 100% with the multi release, however making a full game(20+hours) out of Midgar(if thats what they do) would in my opinion not make for a good release, yes Midgar has a decent start middle and end point for an episode style story. However pushing that to twice as long as it was in the original game just fills it with fluff and hurts the retelling of the story in my opinion, it is sort of wait and see for me. I love FF7 and am more interested in how they retell the story with new twists etc... not in the pretty new graphics and gameplay. I would of rather had a more complete retelling(per release, episode whatever you want to call it) of the game and then had extra quests/exploration etc... added in as DLC. I would honestly also would like to know how many Full games they going to try make out of this story(that is what The Know reported square was calling each release) but that would likely come closer to release, FF7 had flawless pacing and too much fluff would ruin that. Try not take my posts as being to negative at this model, but the gaming industry has made so many mistakes in recent past so any bad news makes me worry a lot for this game.



Last edited by ZeroCool on Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:52 pm; edited 1 time in total

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8 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:51 pm

I might have said that about Team Ninja until a few months back, but here we are now.

Still, i actually kinda meant it both ways. Square is also not very much above sexing it up to pander to it's hikikomori audience either, and though in my humble sorry excuse for an opinion that's better than the alternative, since they're at least pandering to the people that will actually give them money, i hope they'll at least keep it short of tasteless.

Of course, by no means am i the arbiter of what's tasteful or not, and if the game were kept by my definition of not-pandering, it might be a pretty narrow band. Still, it's uncanny how Tifa's boobs end up being such a fitting metaphor for this game's design attitude.

PS: I have no problem with alt-costuming the crap out of characters, so long as they don't go and charge $10 for Aerith's bunny ears. Also Square, do NOT adulter the game for it's western release. I will take that as an insult, and you will not see my money.

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9 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:18 pm

Don't worry, I'm not taking your posts as negative, moreso the FF community's overblown panic in general. Trust me, I love FFVII as well. It's in my top 20 for a reason. In the worst case scenario, though, we've still got the original game, and the PC version can be modified to have higher-resolution textures and a cleaner translation. But as far as FFVII Remake goes, Nomura says that each entry will be like FFXIII with regards to storytelling structure, so each entry could focus on a new character and a completely separate part of the story. Given that information, I've actually heard opinions from fans that say that the multi-part releases might encompass the entire FFVII Compilation. For example, FFVII-1 is the main game and focuses on Cloud, VII-2 is Before Crisis + Crisis Core and focuses on Zack, VII-3 is Advent Children + Dirge of Cerberus and focuses on Cloud and Vincent. I'd be much happier with that release model than the one that everyone is speculating, of course, but I don't think either is really that bad when you get down to it.

As long as there is plenty of actual content (not fluff, not filler) to each release, I'll be happy. Because I'm just like you here. We all are. We don't want to pay full price, just for it to be filled halfway with meaningful content, and halfway with fluff. We don't want the gaming equivalent of a bag of potato chips. So I'm not saying that they should just add quests into a fleshed-out Midgar just for the sake of adding quests. No, they should add quests that enrich that universe in some way, by providing background info on major characters or setting elements.

Ultimately, I'm optimistic, because even if this game fails to deliver on expectations (which it probably will for some people, given how badly hype tends to affect gamers as a whole), we will still have the original game to go back to. Just because they're making the game a Kingdom Hearts-style action-RPG, or a multi-part release, or touching up the story a bit, does NOT mean that our old copies are just going to vanish as soon as this thing gets released. And it also doesn't mean that the game is already good, or bad, or anything. This game shouldn't be good or bad because of how it compares to FFVII, but because of its own merits as a game. If it's good, that's awesome, we'll play it and enjoy it. If it's bad, we'll ignore it, and Square feels the backlash. They'll most likely make enough money from FFXV to risk FFVII Remake being sub-par.

It's just that people complain about every single little thing that Square does nowadays, and can't just wait and see, you know? They feel like they have to judge a game before getting their hands on it, simply because it's not the FFVII they know and love, but an updated take on that game's story and world. I mean, hell, there were people that complained that FFXV got a free demo. There will always be crazy, negative people in the world. They want things exactly how they envision them, and anything less is heresy. That's multiplied 10x for FFVII Remake, because the general gaming community is now involved, not just FF fans. Everyone's wanted this ever since 2006, when we got that tech demo, and now that it's not turn-based, or it's "episodic", or it even has an updated, actually good translation (yes, I've heard complaints about that), that's making some people incredibly upset. I just think everyone needs to chill out.

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10 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:29 pm

K wrote:I might have said that about Team Ninja until a few months back, but here we are now.

Still, i actually kinda meant it both ways. Square is also not very much above sexing it up to pander to it's hikikomori audience either, and though in my humble sorry excuse for an opinion that's better than the alternative, since they're at least pandering to the people that will actually give them money, i hope they'll at least keep it short of tasteless.

Okay, you do make a good point with the Team Ninja thing. And hell, just look at the controversy behind Tracer in Overwatch. So maybe I spoke too soon.

Admittedly, I'd like for this kind of thing to just not be relevant to the conversation of the remake. I'm of the opinion that Tifa's character isn't simply the width of her band, she's a fully fleshed out entity. As long as she REMAINS well-written regardless of what they do with her boobs, I'm fine with it. Personally, I'd like things to stay the same in order to maintain consistency with the rest of her portrayals, because that's how I am, but given recent events, I could understand why they would elect to change that. I'm not heartbroken over it, because again, I can see past that.

And honestly, if people don't buy FFVII because Tifa's boobs are too small/too big? Then that's their loss. SJWs and hikikomori could both stand to learn to look past that sort of thing (yeah, right). Meanwhile, I'll be playing the game because of the things that actually matter.

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11 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:40 pm

Well, i try to speak some sense when being wacky like i was above, but speaking plainly, i don't expect this to be bad. Sure, some expectations will be foiled, and some people will bitch, because Internet, but at the end of the day i don't expect them to either pull an ME3 or anything of the sort.

Nomura is working on this afterall, so i expect it to be a really enjoyable gameplay experience, if nothing else. As for the story, i have a fear that they'll clunk it with too much content and drown the substance. It's not just a matter of writing either; we're talking pacing, directing, atmosphere in general, the music (their remakes of Still More Fighting to date have been kind of pathetic, if you ask me), you name it. And there's the case to be made that some of it will inevitably be lost anyway by losing the ambiguity that goes with low-def. That's not necessarily the case i'd make, but i think it does have some merit, regardless.

Still, i think they have the ability to surpass all those obstacles and deliver an experience that will be true to it's huge legacy. And honestly, i'll forgive any mistakes that would have been made in the pursuit of making a better product, provided Starboy doesn't show up with three colors.

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12 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:32 pm

K wrote:It's not just a matter of writing either; we're talking pacing

Given Nomura's time with the KH series, this has me worried too, but there's no Disney to hinder the continuation of the plot in this case. Unless they deliberately add filler (and FFVII's main story is long enough that it doesn't need it), things should go a lot better than what we've seen in KH. Of course, if this ends up like FFXV and they make it open world, that could really screw with the pacing unless it's carefully crafted. It's the same problem that basically every open-world game can't overcome. Regardless, fast travel is a must, in that case. Every little bit helps.

directing

I'm less worried about the directing in general than I am the voice direction, particularly in English. It's always been a problem with Square, really. I mean, Steve Burton is a fantastic fit for Cloud, but unfortunately, he's often bogged down because their voice directors REALLY don't know how to work with him. Same goes for the majority of their cast in almost every voice-acted work (need I mention Kuja for the hundredth time?). Every single time, the lack of good voice direction is very noticeably reflected in their trademark monotone dialogue and Shatner-esque pauses. It was excusable in the PS2 days when voice acting was still a relatively unexplored concept for games, but I expect better from them at this point.

atmosphere in general

I can see this getting screwed up because of FF being "all serious, all the time" these days, but there are some good counterarguments to that. Both Kingdom Hearts and Dragon Quest spring to mind immediately as some of Square's best works when it comes to having a great balance between the humor, the action, and the dark undertones. Say what you will about Nomura's directing problems, but atmosphere has never been one of his weak points, imho. And considering Nojima and Kitase (the two people behind VII's original story) are on the team handling the story again, I have a feeling that the game's tone will carry over into FFVII Remake. I'm just hoping VIII through XV didn't change the way those two look at FF's composition too much.

the music

Agreed 100%. I like a few tracks from FFX/X-2 Remaster, and about half from both KH 1.5 and 2.5, so I completely understand being wary about the music. There's no doubt Shimomura's going to be the main composer for this one, which is a plus by itself, but her interpretation of the Crisis Core theme in Birth by Sleep is worrying. That being said, her work with One-Winged Angel gives me some hope. In the best case scenario for producers and fans alike, I'd want her to replicate the original tracks almost 1:1, with only a bit of her original style allowed to show through. It really pains me to say it because I love her work to death, but that's the truth of the matter. Either that, or go all-out on an OST that has her stamp clearly shown on it, but I'm sure most fans would be unhappy with that. Of course, the third option is a completely new OST, but considering how large a part the music plays in FF, and how many people cite the music of FFVII as its strongest aspect, no one would be happy there. They're going to have to be incredibly careful when it comes to this.

And there's the case to be made that some of it will inevitably be lost anyway by losing the ambiguity that goes with low-def. That's not necessarily the case i'd make, but i think it does have some merit, regardless.

The game may lose a bit of its cartoonish charm due to this, but otherwise, I think fleshing out the details will ultimately add to the experience. Square's always been very detail-oriented ever since they started using FMVs and pushing the resolution of their games, so it's not like they're going to create something sub-standard to replace the low-def stuff. They'll just have to compensate for some of the situational jokes and hammerspace moments by giving 110% on the game's production values and detail. And lord knows if Square can pull anything off, it's that.

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13 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:40 pm

Honestly, with Kitase behind it, I don't have too much faith in it. Sure, he produced FFX, my favorite game of all time, but that was 15 years ago. He's made some very questionable decisions since then, especially with X-2 and XIII. You can argue that his influence as a producer was somewhat superficial, but I still don't feel comfortable with him at the helm.

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14 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:43 pm

ignoring the release model they using, based off what we have seen I have very mixed feelings on it. Love the graphics and the gameplay looks fast and exciting, but some of the cut scenes we seen were a bit over the top for my tastes when compared to the more tame cut scenes we got in the original, for example cloud jumping on to the train to get away turned into a huge deal when(in my opinion) him just standing on the railing then jumping on the train just works better, its just adding so much more to something that was already good enough but yea that is kind of nit picky so lets wait and see till we get the release.

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15 Re: new FF7 remake details on Thu Apr 07, 2016 7:22 pm

I was kinda kidding with the Tifa's boob size thing (i mean, the point stands, but it was obviously a fringe analogy), but there is one thing - well, two, actually - that i really want to know.

Namely, how the pieces Ahead on our Way and Still More Fighting sound.


Still More Fighting could possibly be the most emblematic piece of FFVII, like Uncharted Worlds is pretty much the defining piece of Mass Effect. It pretty much combines the game's primordial elements into one solid piece that distills what the game is all about. It starts badass, quickly turns kiddy, then finishes epic, setting itself up to cycle all over again. It's one element no remixer i've ever heard, including Uematsu himself, has managed to adapt since (i mean, the Black Mages verison, gimme a break).

Why is this, i think? Well, of the three elements, the kiddy one pretty much fell out of use - and was already nowhere to be seen as of FFVIII - to be replaced with this... teen edgy thing, that market researchers seem in love with.

And this is the part i think Ahead on our Way distilled so perfectly back in FFVII. You reached Kalm, and started hearing a background music that sounds just like what you'd play to a child, and it just fit perfectly. Yeah, there was that vibe of oh wow, i can't tell any of my cool friends i'm playing a game called Final Fantasy VII now, but at that point most of my cool friends were dicks anyway.

And to be clear, i'm not talking about silly or comedic or laughing at itself. Final Fantasy VII stood with a straight face and played a childish song for you, right before it went silent, launched into the prelude to Those Chosen by the Planet, On That Day Five Years Ago, Anxious Hearts, Mako Reactor, full on to the masterpiece of musical horror that is Those Chosen by the Planet again, back to silence, and resumed Ahead on our Way with flawless timing, and it all felt perfect.

The kiddy aspect was one that permeated all of FFVII, from the first time you see the kids playing in the Slums of Midgar, right until the end where Marlene's watching from the window and notices the Lifestream's coming. Not for irony or comedy, but a dead-on integral part of story-telling that combined with everything else that made the game what it was.

Square loses that, it loses some of the story's vital organs right there, and make no mistake, it will show. People might not notice what it is, because everyone seems so out of touch with it in today's culture, but it will be a glaring fault that will be impossible to look over. Because the last thing i want to think about when playing this game is all my cool friends.

So, let me hear what Still More Fighting and Ahead on our Way will sound like. Let me hear what kind of attitude you're going with, crafting this story again.


And don't touch Tifa's boobs.

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16 Re: new FF7 remake details on Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:42 am

If anything i'm curious to see if they'll incorporate crisis core lore into this remake, if they're gonna be multi full games there has to be a lot more content, and i'd love to see continuity from a few crisis core npcs/quests cross over into this game.

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17 Re: new FF7 remake details on Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:50 am

Honestly, I am most worried, that they may change some things for sake of changing them. Making Tifa, Aerith or Yuffie less sexy is not going to make them any more interesting or fleshed out characters. And having fanservice is just fine. It's perfectly normal to want to look at a girl who has clearly feminine, attractive shapes. Add to the fact, that the girl is absolutely awesome, and you have first video game crush of many, many people. Reducing boobs of Tifa, would just be taking away some charm of FFVII. For me, silly was kinda integral part of Final Fantasies since FFV - some would argue even FFIV. Taking away stuff like Don Cornello would be like taking away jokes about Faris, or Zidane grabbing Garnet's ass. It makes story less than it was, taking away a big chunk of charm of said work. I know Square is still bravely making females wear as little as possible (female mechanic from FFXV as example), while still making them even more awesome and well-written, but then again, movements to change that into more "tolerant" version do exist. Who knows, what they will come up with - I have met with argument, that Barret's character is racist and needs to be "corrected" in remake.

However, the possible positive is just too big to just shrug it off. It's just like new Star Wars trilogy. Yes, it can screw up more things than one, but it is not gonna make original any less of an amazing work of art. And if it does things right, it can only make the entire series better for it. It is real shame, that so many people prefer to bash things and critisize everything, usually without any real substance or will to change their mind. It makes so many discussions in Internet just boring and tiring, instead of being enjoyable.

But back to the REMAKE - I think we don't have to worry about graphics, or the music. Shimomura has proven to be amazing composer, and by far hearing soundtrack of FFXV has only made me await game even more. Considering Kingdom Hearts' soundtrack, I think it is gonna do just fine at least. Granted, I would like to hear Uematsu orchestrate the entire thing with full high quality orchestra, but still made to be heard in a video game, instead of any concert. However, I fully trust Shimomura with the thing, without doubt.

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18 Re: new FF7 remake details on Mon May 09, 2016 12:26 am

For me I'm not worried too much visually, story wise, voices, 3 games, etc. only thing that worries me as a Final Fantasy fan is game play mechanics, that's it. They have an existing blue print already on how characters act and such to go off of so I don't expect any Hope or Snow like characters so really my concern is the fighting mechanics.

Being in 2016 I really don't foresee any ATB or turn based style combat since some may consider it dated, so I'm expecting something Kingdom Hearts like especially after what I saw, which I know lot of you would love, just personally I was never much of a fan of KH and FF7 is my fav game so put 2 and 2 together and you have my concerns.

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19 Re: new FF7 remake details on Sat May 21, 2016 11:06 am

I can't help it, but i'm a bit cynical about this game. The modern gaming industry has a lot of very shoddy business practices, and I feel like i'm seeing another of the more recent ones come into play here. What I see with the FFVII remake is a game that could be sold as a long, complete, full price game being sold to us in chunks so Squenix can maximize profits. In the cold calculus, it's kind of smart: The original game is virtually guaranteed to be on tons of peoples greatest game of all time list. It's Final Fantasy VII, need I say more?

When it comes down to it, the original game was released all at once. Their story and world they wanted to sell to us took 3 disks to tell, so they made it into a 3 disk long single release (the only ones I know of that took more than that were FFVIII, FFIX, The Legend of Dragoon, and Myst 2). If they're smart, Squenix won't sell each installment at full price, but even if they sell each part for 40 bucks, they're still trying to shear double the wool from the same sheep, if you pardon the metaphor. I hope this game does well, but with what I've seen of it so far, i'm not feeling too positively inclined towards it.

Also, when did SquareEnix suddenly decide that active time battles were the wrong thing to do? Their games that had ATB or turn base combat were both critical and commercial hits, and it feels like they decided out of nowhere that people didn't like it.

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20 Re: new FF7 remake details on Sat May 21, 2016 11:17 am

Here's the bottom line: Games offer different value. Sometimes you pay 60 bucks for something like The Witcher 3, which lasts you 50 hours at least. Sometimes you pay 60 bucks for a new God of War, which is over in 8 hours. That's how it's been for decades. People like to bring quality over quantity into the equation, but honestly, the top RPG's offer the same quality in minute-to-minute gameplay as other titles. If all of the FF7 remake parts offer at least 8 hours of engaging entertainment, and if they're polished enough, they are worth their price.

People give game prices too much crap. If I want to see a movie, I pay about 10 bucks, but that movie is over in 90 minutes, and I don't even own it and have to repay to see it again. Then again, some games nowadays you don't own either after paying for them, but that's a different topic.

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21 Re: new FF7 remake details on Sat May 21, 2016 11:29 am

You are correct about games offering different run times for the same price. I could go off on criticism of the current pricing model in the industry, but that's not strictly related to what i'm talking about. Here's one difference between the two games you mentioned: Both God of War and Witcher 3 were effectively the same price, correct? CD Projekt Red could have done what SquareEnix is doing, and they could have sold us Witcher 3 in 3 installments at 50-60 bucks each, and said that each piece had significant value compared to God of War, or they could sell it as one contiguous whole for the full price like they did. Now I view CD Projekt Red in a very positive light, because of just how consumer friendly they are.

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22 Re: new FF7 remake details on Sat May 21, 2016 11:51 am

CD Projekt are very consumer friendly, that's true. However, if so many companies release far less value than The Witcher 3 for 60 bucks, Square Enix has no obligation to do it differently. In a perfect world, pricing would be different, but I find it unfair to be picking on SE on this matter when almost everyone else does the same. This just sticks out more, because we're talking about an RPG, and people tend to have different expectations when it comes to that, but again, this just points out the inadequacies in video game pricing in general. It's not SE's obligation to be consumer friendly, when the majority isn't.

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23 Re: new FF7 remake details on Sat May 21, 2016 1:53 pm

Anghellik wrote:Also, when did SquareEnix suddenly decide that active time battles were the wrong thing to do? Their games that had ATB or turn base combat were both critical and commercial hits, and it feels like they decided out of nowhere that people didn't like it.

I think it was more of an attempt to appeal to more people, rather then people that bought the ATB games not liking the system. I would love to see SE do a game with the Grandia battle system, it is my favorite out of the turn based systems(FFX is a very close 2nd).



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24 Re: new FF7 remake details on Sat May 21, 2016 5:28 pm

I don't see the point of arguing the value of the FF7 instalments when the first "episode" isn't event out yet. Wait until it's out, look how much content it offers, then you can judge whether it's fair or not.

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25 Re: new FF7 remake details on Sat May 28, 2016 10:53 pm

In the end there hasn't been much since the announcement trailer that has filled me with optimism about this project.

The battle system is just a pure negative. Don't care for what they are doing there. But that's not enough to sink the game for me either.

The cutting up of the game into parts...is concerning. But no chance I'll get ripped off so not going to make a stink about it. I just plain refuse to buy an unfinished game here. Once FF7 Remake is released (in full and total state) I'll look into buying. Hopefully the initial parts will be cheap enough for it to not be a total rip off.

I get why they have to or feel they have to. Making this thing is expensive and is a great chance to both make money and test the waters of interest. If the early parts flop they can cut bait without expending full resources.

Can go either way. They can intelligently flesh things out into no more than 3 parts and it will be a good (but overpriced) experience. Or they can cut it up into 3 or more parts and stretch out the material with pure filler in order to cash in the most they can and utterly killing any hope of a good FF7 Remake ever.

We'll see what happens. But so far not one bit of information they've actually released about this project has sounded good. Waiting on that.

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