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Committee for Democratic Constitution (Bradley2000, WhiskeyWhiskers, bingcrosby7, KarbinCry, grifinknight)

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Gentlemen,

I've returned from the recess and have approximately 90 minutes to work on the constitution, if the other gentlemen are ready to reconvene.

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bingcrosby7 wrote:Gentlemen,

I've returned from the recess and have approximately 90 minutes to work on the constitution, if the other gentlemen are ready to reconvene.

I am ready if the other members are.

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Gentleman it appears we face a crisis. With this new heir denouncing the throne we are left in a precarious position.

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Death Penalty
Passed by 4 votes to 0 has been banned
Is it to be in the bill of rights? - 1 vote for against 0

Judiciary
In severe cases (life punishment) - 1 vote against 1 (fttb)
Limitations of jury system to non-criminal with exception of treason, sedition, rebellion - 2 votes against 0

System of governance
Monarchy without an heir or republic?

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KarbinCry wrote:Death Penalty
Passed by 4 votes to 0 has been banned
Is it to be in the bill of rights? - 1 vote for against 0

Judiciary
In severe cases (life punishment) - 1 vote against 1 (fttb)
Limitations of jury system to non-criminal with exception of treason, sedition, rebellion - 2 votes against 0

System of governance
Monarchy without an heir or republic?

If we have no monarchical bloodline, it seems as though we currently have two options: 1) establish a new bloodline, or 2) move forward as a republic. Any thoughts on this matter before we set out to vote?

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Gentleman I hereby put forward a motion for the heir to be allowed into these discussions.


Yay or Nay

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bradley2000 wrote:Gentleman I hereby put forward a motion for the heir to be allowed into these discussions.


Yay or Nay

If he is to be admitted, we have to ascertain the following:
1) is he interested
2) what does he want from the constitution

Remember how we were picked. One centralist, one decentralist, a federalist and a neutral party. We have to maintain some kind of balance, which means we should be open to a neutral or a slight centralist.

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KarbinCry wrote:
bradley2000 wrote:Gentleman I hereby put forward a motion for the heir to be allowed into these discussions.


Yay or Nay

If he is to be admitted, we have to ascertain the following:
1) is he interested
2) what does he want from the constitution

Remember how we were picked. One centralist, one decentralist, a federalist and a neutral party. We have to maintain some kind of balance, which means we should be open to a neutral or a slight centralist.


Only to hear his opinion on these matters.

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bradley2000 wrote:
KarbinCry wrote:
bradley2000 wrote:Gentleman I hereby put forward a motion for the heir to be allowed into these discussions.


Yay or Nay

If he is to be admitted, we have to ascertain the following:
1) is he interested
2) what does he want from the constitution

Remember how we were picked. One centralist, one decentralist, a federalist and a neutral party. We have to maintain some kind of balance, which means we should be open to a neutral or a slight centralist.


Only to hear his opinion on these matters.

The heir most definitely should be present but should not exert power over the drafting of the constitution.

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bradley2000 wrote:
KarbinCry wrote:
bradley2000 wrote:Gentleman I hereby put forward a motion for the heir to be allowed into these discussions.


Yay or Nay

If he is to be admitted, we have to ascertain the following:
1) is he interested
2) what does he want from the constitution

Remember how we were picked. One centralist, one decentralist, a federalist and a neutral party. We have to maintain some kind of balance, which means we should be open to a neutral or a slight centralist.


Only to hear his opinion on these matters.

That hardly helps. If we hear his opinion, we have to hear everyones, and we are back to square one. And he can observe now should he choose to.
Either we give him a vote, or we maintain status quo. After all, nothing prohibits other groups from drafting their own constitutions.

Also, I find it worrying Zeiss, from the get go, violated the principle of representation for seemingly populist reasons.

And he forfeited his birthright. To treat him as more than an ordinary citizen would be to our detriment.

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Zeiss is definitely employing populist rhetoric in the public square, but we have taken into consideration the wants and needs of the people; and, thus far, we have constructed a constitutional framework that advances individual rights. This will, I assume, appease a majority of the individuals of the kingdom; and, if we use cogent reasoning to explain the rationale behind specific “problems” with the constitution, I believe a majority of the populace will stand behind it. That said, we ought to be transparent as possible and we should consider proceeding as a republic.

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bingcrosby7 wrote:Zeiss is definitely employing populist rhetoric in the public square, but we have taken into consideration the wants and needs of the people; and, thus far, we have constructed a constitutional framework that advances individual rights. This will, I assume, appease a majority of the individuals of the kingdom; and, if we use cogent reasoning to explain the rationale behind specific “problems” with the constitution, I believe a majority of the populace will stand behind it. That said, we ought to be transparent as possible and we should consider proceeding as a republic.

As much as I wanted a Constitutional monarchy you may be right. Bah! this needs more thought.

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I suggest creating a system of Advocates for our Comitee.

So far, we have Aberiskan, Southportian and a Versbergian - we can advocate for the reform in our respective regions.
I do suggest deputising, however, not just 5 people from the other islands, but also other three as our "redundancies" - we will not have as much time to advocate in the regions.

These I nominate as people we should approach:
Lorinbas - City Central
Braigwen - Northport
Chaos_Ryder - Versberg
MegaZeroX - Southport

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bradley2000 wrote:
bingcrosby7 wrote:Zeiss is definitely employing populist rhetoric in the public square, but we have taken into consideration the wants and needs of the people; and, thus far, we have constructed a constitutional framework that advances individual rights. This will, I assume, appease a majority of the individuals of the kingdom; and, if we use cogent reasoning to explain the rationale behind specific “problems” with the constitution, I believe a majority of the populace will stand behind it. That said, we ought to be transparent as possible and we should consider proceeding as a republic.

As much as I wanted a Constitutional monarchy you may be right. Bah! this needs more thought.

Had the monarch not been found, there would have easily been a case for a constitutional monarchy; however, since we apparently have a former monarch within the citizenry who will undoubtedly become a member of the senate, it looks like we have no other option than to proceed as a republic.

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KarbinCry wrote:I suggest creating a system of Advocates for our Comitee.

So far, we have Aberiskan, Southportian and a Versbergian - we can advocate for the reform in our respective regions.
I do suggest deputising, however, not just 5 people from the other islands, but also other three as our "redundancies" - we will not have as much time to advocate in the regions.

These I nominate as people we should approach:
Lorinbas - City Central
Braigwen - Northport
Chaos_Ryder - Versberg
MegaZeroX - Southport


Could you please expand on these peoples roles and power?.

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Their role would be to explain what we are doing to the public, and in turn, take the public suggestions and opinions for us, so that we can craft a document supported by the public.

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KarbinCry wrote:Their role would be to explain what we are doing to the public, and in turn, take the public suggestions and opinions for us, so that we can craft a document supported by the public.

That seems reasonable.

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KarbinCry wrote:I suggest creating a system of Advocates for our Comitee.

So far, we have Aberiskan, Southportian and a Versbergian - we can advocate for the reform in our respective regions.
I do suggest deputising, however, not just 5 people from the other islands, but also other three as our "redundancies" - we will not have as much time to advocate in the regions.

These I nominate as people we should approach:
Lorinbas - City Central
Braigwen - Northport
Chaos_Ryder - Versberg
MegaZeroX - Southport

These are all great picks--I trust they will conduct themselves honorably, and I have no reservations about any of these representatives.

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Death Penalty
Passed by 4 votes to 0 has been banned
Is it to be in the bill of rights? - 1 vote for against 0

Judiciary
In severe cases (life punishment) - 1 vote against 1 (fttb)
Limitations of jury system to non-criminal with exception of treason, sedition, rebellion - 2 votes against 0

System of governance
Passed Republic by 3 votes to 0

Advocacy and outreach to the public
Passed Approach deputies to advocate for our work and find out the public opinion and suggestions - 3 votes to 0
Candidates:
Lorinbas - City Central
Braigwen - Northport
Chaos_Ryder - Versberg
MegaZeroX - Southport
All 2 votes to 0

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KarbinCry wrote:Death Penalty
Passed by 4 votes to 0 has been banned
Is it to be in the bill of rights? - 1 vote for against 0

Judiciary
In severe cases (life punishment) - 1 vote against 1 (fttb)
Limitations of jury system to non-criminal with exception of treason, sedition, rebellion - 2 votes against 0

System of governance
Passed Republic by 3 votes to 0

Advocacy and outreach to the public
Passed Approach deputies to advocate for our work and find out the public opinion and suggestions - 3 votes to 0
Candidates:
Lorinbas - City Central
Braigwen - Northport
Chaos_Ryder - Versberg
MegaZeroX - Southport
All 2 votes to 0

I believe the anti-death penalty law should be added to the bill of rights and I will also advance the above mentioned judiciary measures.

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bingcrosby7 wrote:
KarbinCry wrote:Death Penalty
Passed by 4 votes to 0 has been banned
Is it to be in the bill of rights? - 1 vote for against 0

Judiciary
In severe cases (life punishment) - 1 vote against 1 (fttb)
Limitations of jury system to non-criminal with exception of treason, sedition, rebellion - 2 votes against 0

System of governance
Passed Republic by 3 votes to 0

Advocacy and outreach to the public
Passed Approach deputies to advocate for our work and find out the public opinion and suggestions - 3 votes to 0
Candidates:
Lorinbas - City Central
Braigwen - Northport
Chaos_Ryder - Versberg
MegaZeroX - Southport
All 2 votes to 0

I believe the anti-death penalty law should be added to the bill of rights and I will also advance the above mentioned judiciary measures.

I concur let us be done with this.

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So, for the sake of speed, I suggest:
I contact Braigwen and MegaZeroX
bradley contacts Chaos_Ryder and Lorinbas
bingcrosby7 will post a recruitment post in the main thread, calling for advocates from other parts of Echain; Eastport, Plainsdale, Waltens, Lurem; also, they have to be pro-democracy, ideally centrist (so that here is little bias). This prohibits communists, but how can they advocate for a Constitution that is to be democratic?

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KarbinCry wrote:So, for the sake of speed, I suggest:
I contact Braigwen and MegaZeroX
bradley contacts Chaos_Ryder and Lorinbas
bingcrosby7 will post a recruitment post in the main thread, calling for advocates from other parts of Echain; Eastport, Plainsdale, Waltens, Lurem; also, they have to be pro-democracy, ideally centrist (so that here is little bias). This prohibits communists, but how can they advocate for a Constitution that is to be democratic?

I ask for the gentleman to provide me with time to draft a recruitment letter; I shall post a working draft in this section before making it public.

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KarbinCry wrote:So, for the sake of speed, I suggest:
I contact Braigwen and MegaZeroX
bradley contacts Chaos_Ryder and Lorinbas
bingcrosby7 will post a recruitment post in the main thread, calling for advocates from other parts of Echain; Eastport, Plainsdale, Waltens, Lurem; also, they have to be pro-democracy, ideally centrist (so that here is little bias). This prohibits communists, but how can they advocate for a Constitution that is to be democratic?

Very good.

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It seems counter-intuitive to open this process to the public further. We are already making our decisions public, the entire point of this committee was to make discussions quicker. We should proceed as we have been, present our document at the end and if any object they may show their own proposed constitution for consideration by the public.

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