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Old Ministry of Defense

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101 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:39 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:
(MoD) Bradley3000 wrote:I don't believe the President is to blame as there is nothing to be blamed for.
Whether you do or not, is neither here nor there. Allowing a political party run by the director of intelligence to approach in secret the Minister of Defence and get special treatment is a major failing of the president.


There is no special treatment.

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102 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:42 am

See, it is far easier to be influenced by another Echaini than a foreigner. As to your pledge to "watch" the trainers, that is almost laughably naive. You'd have to have enough unbiased, pure men, who undestand what is teaching and what is propaganda, meaning they know something about military training meaning... they could do the job themselves.

You also mentioned some groups approached you. That's fair and well, but if they approached the Ministry, why hasn't the Ministry approached other groups as well?
By this fact itself there is special treatment of groups which, ironically, approach the Military quite possibly from the wish to control it, because groups who do not actively come to your doorstep are automatically exempt from the discussion for you.

To close my personal opinion on the matter: we can have an army trained by people who know very little about proper military tactics and strategies and are quite possibly personally loyal to specific outside figures, or we can have an army trained by experts who actually know how an army is supposed to look like, and since they're foreign, their ability to spew propaganda and riddle the military with agents of specific people would be drastically lower.

Gee, what a terribly hard choice to make. After all, both are such an equally great options, right?

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103 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:43 am

Not now that we noticed it! There was though.

Why will you not agree to foreign military experts? Is it perhaps because you do know the party political platform of the EAM and agree with it?



Last edited by Governor WhiskeyWhiskers on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:45 am; edited 1 time in total

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104 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:44 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:Not now that we noticed it! There was though.

That again is unfounded I changed the document before you mentioned it.

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105 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:45 am

Director Karbin Cry (NB) wrote:See, it is far easier to be influenced by another Echaini than a foreigner. As to your pledge to "watch" the trainers, that is almost laughably naive. You'd have to have enough unbiased, pure men, who undestand what is teaching and what is propaganda, meaning they know something about military training meaning... they could do the job themselves.

You also mentioned some groups approached you. That's fair and well, but if they approached the Ministry, why hasn't the Ministry approached other groups as well?
By this fact itself there is special treatment of groups which, ironically, approach the Military quite possibly from the wish to control it, because groups who do not actively come to your doorstep are automatically exempt from the discussion for you.

To close my personal opinion on the matter: we can have an army trained by people who know very little about proper military tactics and strategies and are quite possibly personally loyal to specific outside figures, or we can have an army trained by experts who actually know how an army is supposed to look like, and since they're foreign, their ability to spew propaganda and riddle the military with agents of specific people would be drastically lower.

Gee, what a terribly hard choice to make. After all, both are such an equally great options, right?



Again I have ZERO power over this. I AM NOT THE PRESIDENT.

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106 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:47 am

You set the direction of this ministry. You have the power to set as policy the acquisition of foreign military experts to train the army. The ministry of foreign affairs would then have to approach countries and attempt to negotiate that. You have that power!



Last edited by Governor WhiskeyWhiskers on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:49 am; edited 1 time in total

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107 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:48 am

Oh, I forgot the Minister of Defence and Commander-in-Chief has absolutely no power to decide anything about he military, nor any power to actually use to convince people of something.

Silly me.

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108 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:52 am

Director Karbin Cry (NB) wrote:Oh, I forgot the Minister of Defence and Commander-in-Chief has absolutely no power to decide anything about he military, nor any power to actually use to convince people of something.

Silly me.


Fine, you have me convinced. I will be decisive and will hire foreign experts. However if this goes bad I will always hold you accountable.

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109 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 1:54 am

Well, I believe you can consider us a beginning of an alliance for foreign experts.
(Note, though, that I am its part personally, as the Bank has no interest in the matter)

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110 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 3:30 am

I think I must chime in here.

First I offered the Minister the services of the Guards, which are know the Republican Guards I want to remind you all, as all ready many of my men joined up with the military and the question came up in discussions regarding the supply of our army. I have no intentions on influencing the army or the MoD in any way. I simply support the Lord Minister in any way possible.

Director Karbin Cry, I find it insulting that you insinuate that my men have no idea of military tactics and what not. They served in the Royal Guards for years, most were former members of the old Echain military and are experienced with the real deal and not only guerrilla tactics as most other groups in Echain. Some again fought with me for more than two years in Spain with the Nationalist against the red menace. I see it as my duty to say this, as the honour of my men is at stake here.

I also hereby want to state officially that all man that will train the army will be released from their services within the Guards and are not longer considered members. This men have no affiliation with the Guards and are independent individuals  free to do as they wish, for they are not the part of any organisation any more. What they wish to do as free man is not within my responsibilities and influnce.



Last edited by Governor Lorinbas on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:24 am; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Added last third part)

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111 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:20 am

THE EDITED AND COMPLETE STATEMENT FROM THE MINISTRY OF DEFENCE.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1yCUil0ry2RjD9xOkblm0AS48RzOFZVUJUhqQsbskAHQ/edit


OOC: You wanna play semantics Governor WhiskeyWhiskers and KarbinCry then i'll play. Wink Wink. I think you will enjoy the part about training. tongue

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112 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:27 am

Well thanks for confirming that you are ideologically tied to the EAM and are using your post for political purposes, I guess.

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113 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:29 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:Well thanks for confirming that you are ideologically tied to the EAM and are using your post for political purposes, I guess.


There is no mention of the EAM anywhere in this document.

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114 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:30 am

Mr WhiskyWhiskers what are you talking about? Where do you see the involvement of the EAM?

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115 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:33 am

Correct, but after agreeing to an attempt at inviting foreign military experts, you have reneged and instead insisted on using former members of the Royal Guard. Given the deception you have thus far used I can't imagine anyone won't see this for what it is.

The EAM is committed to a nationalist and isolationist cause. These moves are clear attempts at promoting this ideology. Why else will you not even enter talks with other nations over military training?



Last edited by Governor WhiskeyWhiskers on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:35 am; edited 1 time in total

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116 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:35 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:Correct, but after agreeing to an attempt at inviting foreign military experts, you have reneged and instead insisted on using former members of the Royal Guard. Given the deception you have thus far used I can't imagine anyone won't see this for what it is.


So you would rather have random foreigners train our men instead of trained professionals? if this is the case then I have to question your commitment to the people of Echain.

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117 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:36 am

(MoD) Bradley3000 wrote:
So you would rather have random foreigners train our men instead of trained professionals? if this is the case then I have to question your commitment to the people of Echain.

I would rather anyone than fighters who fought with Franco against the Republic of Spain. The Royal Guard are collaborators with Nazis and fascists.

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118 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:37 am

I am not, as well as the Guards are NOT members of the EAM! I and my organisation are affiliated with the Constitutonal Party. The men training the army are individuals and not affiliated with any group or ideology.

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119 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:39 am

I did not say they were.

Governor Lorinbas wrote:Some again fought with me for more than two years in Spain with the Nationalist against the red menace.

If you would rather I retract my statement and say that it is a clear promotion of your own nationalist ideology, I will do that willingly.

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120 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:40 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:
(MoD) Bradley3000 wrote:
Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:
So you would rather have random foreigners train our men instead of trained professionals? if this is the case then I have to question your commitment to the people of Echain.

I would rather anyone than fighters who fought with Franco against the Republic of Spain. The Royal Guard are collaborators with Nazis and fascists.


How dare you accuse good citizens of our great nation of being Nazi sympathisers. Not one member of that guard will ever praise that ruthless tyrant and if you must resort to such unbecoming behaviour then clearly you have no argument other than ideology. Please tell the people of Echain that the reason they have an untrained army is because of politics, I am sure that will go well.

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121 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:41 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:
(MoD) Bradley3000 wrote:
So you would rather have random foreigners train our men instead of trained professionals? if this is the case then I have to question your commitment to the people of Echain.

I would rather anyone than fighters who fought with Franco against the Republic of Spain. The Royal Guard are collaborators with Nazis and fascists.

Really WhiskyWhiskers?! Your Republicans murdered as much as the Nationalists did. Do think that you have any moral high ground. Any right to insinuate an alliance with the Reich? We may have fought side by side with Germany but where again do you see the difference between Hitler and Stalin?
All I see here is a stuck up, arrogant ideologist.



Last edited by Governor Lorinbas on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:44 am; edited 1 time in total

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122 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:44 am

I think if you will recall Stalin had no great love for the anarchists of Catalonia with whom I fought. We fought pitched street battles against the Stalinists. Can you say the same for yourself and the Condor legion?

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123 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:45 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:I think if you will recall Stalin had no great love for the anarchists of Catalonia with whom I fought. We fought pitched street battles against the Stalinists. Can you say the same for yourself and the Condor legion?


Again this is irrelevant. You are acting out of emotion and ideology. These men are well trained and from Echain.

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124 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:46 am

As are the militias of Versberg and Eastport. Yet you have still not added them to the list of militias considered for training.

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125 Re: Old Ministry of Defense on Sat Jan 21, 2017 4:47 am

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:As are the militias of Versberg and Eastport. Yet you have still not added them to the list of militias considered for training.


Rad-tag militias are nowhere near trained enough.

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