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Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act

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1 Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:06 pm

The Minimum Wage Act

Goal:To create a national minimum wage tied to the cost of living that will be subject to change depending on the times and the prosperity of Echain.

Drafted by Governor Alexander and co-sponsored by Governor WhiskeyWhiskers.



Last edited by Governor WhiskeyWhiskers on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:15 pm; edited 1 time in total

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2 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:14 pm

A bill for...ermmm your consideration good Governors, please ask any questions you wish.


I obviously vote AYE hahaha...ha.

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3 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:16 pm

I have a couple points.

First, I do not understand the passage "As this is a national matter this bill must have the consent of 6/9 regions". Is it supposed to mean that the minimun wage has to be set by consent ov 2/3 of the Governors? Because, as it is now, it could be argued it is legally relevant in case of all other acts which are a "national matter" - which are, by definition, all acts that the Council has the power to enact.

Second, five-year term is impractical since some Councils would lose a part of their power to nothing but fortune. What about grounding the change in "First year of any new Council"? The period will change but slightly to 4 years, and parity of Council's will remain intact.

Third, I strongly protest both Exceptions. First one truly is absurd, as it is not an exception. Second is dangerous, as it effectively limits education to the rich. Students from poor backgrounds need to work to fund their studies, and thanks to such exception, they'd need to work more (because not to work isn't an option for them) and thus study less.

*during the whole speech, Felix ignores Whiskers entirely*

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4 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:17 pm

Can you explain what anti-social behavior means under maids and waiters?

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5 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:19 pm

Felix Clary zu Osegg wrote:I have a couple points.

First, I do not understand the passage "As this is a national matter this bill must have the consent of 6/9 regions". Is it supposed to mean that the minimun wage has to be set by consent ov 2/3 of the Governors? Because, as it is now, it could be argued it is legally relevant in case of all other acts which are a "national matter" - which are, by definition, all acts that the Council has the power to enact.

Second, five-year term is impractical since some Councils would lose a part of their power to nothing but fortune. What about grounding the change in "First year of any new Council"? The period will change but slightly to 4 years, and parity of Council's will remain intact.

Third, I strongly protest both Exceptions. First one truly is absurd, as it is not an exception. Second is dangerous, as it effectively limits education to the rich. Students from poor backgrounds need to work to fund their studies, and thanks to such exception, they'd need to work more (because not to work isn't an option for them) and thus study less.

*during the whole speech, Felix ignores Whiskers entirely*


I can agree to these terms and will change the bill to reflect this.

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6 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:20 pm

The two exceptions had been amended, which gave rise to their unusual language. The first talking of tipping culture used to allow for hospitality workers to be paid below minimum wage with tips making up the difference.

The second actually makes universities pay their students a wage at 85% of the national minimum wage to study.

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7 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:22 pm

Still the first is completely irrelevant. If the minimum wage includes all professions, then it includes waiters. No need to mention them specifically (in fact, legally speaking, it weakens the bill).

And the second condition is still problematic, as it makes higher education much more costly, and thus it hurts our ability to increase its capacities. I propose we change it to 33 or 50 percent so the Government can afford to pay for more students.

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8 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:23 pm

I honestly think this should be up to the seperate regions. Each region has a different cost to live in and therefore it should be inter-changeable between regions. By not making it a unanimous vote, there is a possibility of oppressing the minority in this matter, which I would like to avoid.

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9 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:26 pm

I'm not sure about other Regions but The Echain Free University provides free room and board along with Free tuition as part of the Constitutional Sections callin for it's existance.

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10 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:26 pm

Governor Grifenknight wrote:I honestly think this should be up to the seperate regions.  Each region has a different cost to live in and therefore it should be inter-changeable between regions.  By not making it a unanimous vote, there is a possibility of oppressing the minority in this matter, which I would like to avoid.


If this were left to different regions then some regions would have deliberately low wages to the detriment of the people in order to sway business in regions with a higher wage to their region.

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11 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:27 pm

What? There is a free university?

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12 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:27 pm

Governor Grifenknight wrote:What?  There is a free university?

Yes, that's the special university established by the Constitution.

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13 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:28 pm

Governor Alexander wrote:
Governor Grifenknight wrote:I honestly think this should be up to the seperate regions.  Each region has a different cost to live in and therefore it should be inter-changeable between regions.  By not making it a unanimous vote, there is a possibility of oppressing the minority in this matter, which I would like to avoid.


If this were left to different regions then some regions would have deliberately low wages to  the detriment of the people in order to sway business in regions with a higher wage to their region.

But how can poor Regions like Aberisk and Lurem keep up to the higher standards of Central and Eastport? We barely have any industry

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14 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:28 pm

Are the changes to your liking Felix?.....I mean Governor Osegg?.

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15 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:29 pm

Governor Alexander wrote:
Governor Grifenknight wrote:I honestly think this should be up to the seperate regions.  Each region has a different cost to live in and therefore it should be inter-changeable between regions.  By not making it a unanimous vote, there is a possibility of oppressing the minority in this matter, which I would like to avoid.


If this were left to different regions then some regions would have deliberately low wages to  the detriment of the people in order to sway business in regions with a higher wage to their region.

And that would only lead to discontent and productivity in the region which would only bite them in the ass. I asked Lore about this last week and he told me that the normal cost for living(in Lurem I believe) was about 300-ish per month. With normal hours and work days, 10 ESP is insane, especially with only 100 Million ESP in circulation and almost 2 million people in the country...

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16 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:29 pm

But then, wouldn't workers from Aberisk and Lurem move for greater wages to other Regions?
I am for a unitary minimum wage, but perhaps it could be set as a median, not an average.

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17 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:31 pm

Felix Clary zu Osegg wrote:Still the first is completely irrelevant. If the minimum wage includes all professions, then it includes waiters. No need to mention them specifically (in fact, legally speaking, it weakens the bill).

And the second condition is still problematic, as it makes higher education much more costly, and thus it hurts our ability to increase its capacities. I propose we change it to 33 or 50 percent so the Government can afford to pay for more students.

Agreed that the first is completely irrelevant. It's an artifact of an earlier draft.

As for the percentage of the wage paid to students I leave that to Governor Alexander to negotiate.

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18 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:31 pm

Felix Clary zu Osegg wrote:But then, wouldn't workers from Aberisk and Lurem move for greater wages to other Regions?
I am for a unitary minimum wage, but perhaps it could be set as a median, not an average.

But the problem is that with higher wages come higher costs of living.

OOC: I know about this too much. The region I live in irl is really expensive to live in compared to nearby regions because the wages are much higher compared to those regions.
Essentially...
My area= High living cost is to High wages
like
other areas= Low living costs is to low wages

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19 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:32 pm

Felix Clary zu Osegg wrote:But then, wouldn't workers from Aberisk and Lurem move for greater wages to other Regions?
I am for a unitary minimum wage, but perhaps it could be set as a median, not an average.


I can agree to a median instead of an average.

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20 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:33 pm

I believe it would serve this bill and our legal order if this was accepted as an amendment to National Finances Act

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21 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:36 pm

What if we put in a provision that if a region's living costs are an outlier compared to other regions their minimum wage will be set separately by the National Bank?

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22 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:37 pm

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:What if we put in a provision that if a region's living costs are an outlier compared to other regions their minimum wage will be set separately by the National Bank?


I still think it should be median so the bank will discern the median in each region and set the wage as that if agreed by the Governors.

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23 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:38 pm



I think the minimum wage should be a separate thing entirely and stand steadfast but either way it would not make much difference.

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24 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:39 pm

If we make it a median of regional medians, the resulting number should prove consensual.

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25 Re: Council of Governors - Minimum Wage Act on Thu Feb 16, 2017 11:40 pm

You guys are ignoring me...

I asked Lore last week about the normal living costs(In Lurem) per month. He told me about 300-ish(I dont remember the exact number). I did the math and with a 10 hour day and 6 day work weeks and even 2 ESP an hour is alot. 10 ESP an hour IS INSANE.(I believe you changed the bill, but it did state that the average living cost is 10 ESP an hour)

Also, you have to remember that with areas with higher wages, the price of living goes up. Im sure the same applies in this world. You also have to remember that there is only 100 Million ESP in circulation right now with a population of about 2 million people(I think thats right). The strain on businesses would be crazy...

OOC: I believe you changed the bill as I was typing this so...

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