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LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private]

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1 LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 4:47 pm

Due to the potential for political fallout this private forum is in session for the issue with our southern neighbor.

From this point on the following code names will be used

Indonesia = Gracemeria
Native Indonesians = Partisans
Japanese Volunteer Division = Freedom Fighters
Dutch = The Empire



Last edited by Governor Gollvieg on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:57 pm; edited 1 time in total

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2 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:11 pm

First things first we must acknowledge that any action we take with Gracemaria will upset The Empire in someway and so if we do anything it is almost assured we will severe all relations now and in the future with The Empire. I am fine with this as The Empire is hardly powerful after the war but I just thought I would mention it.

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3 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:16 pm

Maybe it is through my family relations to the people of the Empire, but I am strongly against any military action against them.

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4 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:38 pm

Governor Lorinbas wrote:Maybe it is through my family relations to the people of the Empire, but I am strongly against any military action against them.

I doubt that the Empire is in any true position to hold Gracemeria. They have severely weakened themselves in Europe and it is only a matter of time before they capitulate Gracemeria. The only question is are we going to take steps to improve our relationship with the Partisans or will we start out on the wrong foot with them. I would like to remind everyone that the Freedom Fighters will leave once the liberation ends and we would lose our point of contact with the Partisans



Last edited by Governor Gollvieg on Sat Feb 25, 2017 11:49 pm; edited 3 times in total

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5 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:38 pm

I am for sending a volunteer group over to aid in Gracemeria's independence, but any official aid from Echain might be too risky.

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6 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:41 pm

I can live with a volunteer group, and I mean real volunteers. Not like the Germans did in Spain. I fought alongside these guys and belief me they were many things, but a volunteers force was not one of them.

But I am strongly against any form of official support from our side.

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7 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:42 pm

I suggest we send in Darpon under the disguise of the partisans (if they agree) and only the partisans will know it is us who sent them. We can ask in return for some agreement whereby Gracemeria becomes a vassal of Echain whom can handle it's internal affairs and we handle all things trade and military.

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8 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:45 pm

That would be the best outcome, though I must say that a possible vassal-status of Gracemeria would be preferable to any other alternative, I must also say that I belief it to be highly unlikely.

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9 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:46 pm

Governor Lorinbas wrote:That would be the best outcome, though I must say that a possible vassal-status of Gracemeria would be preferable to any other alternative, I must also say that I belief it to be highly unlikely.

We must at least offer them this.

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10 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:47 pm

I doubt they would want to become a vassal of a shitty little island nation.

A better proposal would be integration into our nation. They would be their own region. Vassal sounds to overlord-ish.

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11 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 5:47 pm

Governor Alexander wrote:
Governor Lorinbas wrote:That would be the best outcome, though I must say that a possible vassal-status of Gracemeria would be preferable to any other alternative, I must also say that I belief it to be highly unlikely.

We must at least offer them this.

I am in agreement with you there.

Grifen could you call our great nation please not as a "shitty little island"?

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12 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:37 pm

The absorption of Gracemeria into our civil union would add at least 7 Regions to our Confederacy would that be okay with everyone here?

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13 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:39 pm

Governor Gollvieg wrote:The absorption of Gracemeria into our civil union would add at least 7 Regions to our Confederacy would that be okay with everyone here?

I think that would be far too overwhelming, we need a Dominion system like that of the UK. Let them have their own Council of Governors for internal matters while Echain decides all external matters including the military.

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14 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:41 pm

Not really. I would prefer if we simply liberated them and had them as an ally. If we were to annex Gracemeria we would simply find ourselves eventually having to tamp down the same nationalist grumbles that caused them to fight the Empire.

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15 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:43 pm

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:Not really. I would prefer if we simply liberated them and had them as an ally. If we were to annex Gracemeria we would simply find ourselves eventually having to tamp down the same nationalist grumbles that caused them to fight the Empire.

We would not simply dominate them, under the Empire they could make ZERO decisions for themselves. What I propose is 10x better than what the Empire has done.

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16 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:45 pm

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:Not really. I would prefer if we simply liberated them and had them as an ally. If we were to annex Gracemeria we would simply find ourselves eventually having to tamp down the same nationalist grumbles that caused them to fight the Empire.

OOC: I agree, rather than trying to seize the entire nation we should just support and ally with them and as new players come in we can add the Gracemerian Regions one by one.

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17 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:47 pm

Governor Gollvieg wrote:
Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:Not really. I would prefer if we simply liberated them and had them as an ally. If we were to annex Gracemeria we would simply find ourselves eventually having to tamp down the same nationalist grumbles that caused them to fight the Empire.

OOC: I agree, rather than trying to seize the entire nation we should just support and ally with them and as new players come in we can add the Gracemerian Regions one by one.

OOC: That would not work in character unless we took them over or else it would just be "your liberated yay let's ally" new player joins "syke you are now part of Echain and have Governors".

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18 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:50 pm

Gracemeria is vastly larger and more populous that us, so I doubt they're agree to become our vassal. Especially since they had the just freed themselves from another inferior overlord. In the best case, we'll get an ally with a debt of honor. While that might be valuable, would that be worth risking a war and the possible attention of the US and their allies? They might ignore the war right now, considering it a domestic matter for the Empire.. but this might change when another foreign power becomes involved.

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19 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:53 pm

Governor Ceca Sander wrote:Gracemeria is vastly larger and more populous that us, so I doubt they're agree to become our vassal. Especially since they had the just freed themselves from another inferior overlord. In the best case, we'll get an ally with a debt of honor. While that might be valuable, would that be worth risking a war and the possible attention of the US and their allies? They might ignore the war right now, considering it a domestic matter for the Empire.. but this might change when another foreign power becomes involved.

Due to the situation there and the special protected status of the Freedom Fighters, the US will not intervene unless the Empire beg them and they will not want to in debit themselves further

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20 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 6:56 pm

OOC: I don't see how the game is going to progress if we don't expand unless we just stay exactly as we are now and hope for the best when the introduction of the non-mundane vote comes. Or of course if players reject the vote then we just stay on Echain forever.

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21 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 7:04 pm

What special protected status do these Freedom Fighters have?

(ooc: Why is sticking with Echain bad? This isn't a game of world conquest, or anything)

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22 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 7:06 pm

Governor Ceca Sander wrote:What special protected status do these Freedom Fighters have?

(ooc: Why is sticking with Echain bad? This isn't a game of world conquest, or anything)

OOC: Because there is only so much the GM can come up with for a small island in the pacific. Unless Lore says otherwise of course, it would probably be wise to have his input on this tbh.

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23 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 7:10 pm

(ooc: not sure how that is going too change much by adding some larger Pacific islands. Anyway, I think this subject is best discussed in ooc, to be honest)

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24 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 7:12 pm

Governor Ceca Sander wrote:(ooc: not sure how that is going too change much by adding some larger Pacific islands. Anyway, I think this subject is best discussed in ooc, to be honest)

OOC: There are plenty of things like international ramifications, managing of a different peoples, larger demands, bigger role in international politics. But yeah it should be discussed in the OOC thread.

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25 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sat Feb 25, 2017 7:42 pm

OOC: I understand you want to expand the game, but we are only like 6 turns in... This would never happen IC. Can you name one nation ever that gained it's independence then 6 months later, attempted to start conquering or integrating other nations...

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