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LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private]

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76 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sun Feb 26, 2017 12:02 pm

2 seems to be the obvious choice from my side.
Regarding the others. I would be ok with 1 but only, and I mean only, if this was not an official action of the nation of Echain but as a volunteer force.
I do not really see any point in 3 to be honest.

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77 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sun Feb 26, 2017 12:24 pm

"The Partisans have the advantage and will win against the Empire eventually. The Empire is barely holding on to Gracemeria with the current forces they have. If we want to help the Partisans to end their fight quickly and with minimal bloodshed, we need to get rid of the people who are critical to the command and control of the occupation. I would like to see them feed their troops when the only people who knows where all the food is, all dies to flu like symptoms."

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78 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sun Feb 26, 2017 1:20 pm

*outside the building where secret meeting just took place*

Huh, I wonder what this was about. Well, not important now.

*Throws out brief on Indonesia, including codename explanations, to a public bin*

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79 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sun Feb 26, 2017 1:25 pm

Felix Clary zu Osegg wrote:*outside the building where secret meeting just took place*

Huh, I wonder what this was about. Well, not important now.

*Throws out brief on Indonesia, including codename explanations, to a public bin*


OOC: Did you just......do that?. If so the Governor of Eastport is about to suffer a massive accident at the hands of an Agent with the name "47".

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80 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sun Feb 26, 2017 1:45 pm

OOC: I guess I did. But it doesn't take a genius to break the "code". And we're apparently making a readable, unencrypted transcript, so me throwing away the code is hardly our biggest security problem.

Also, remember I have a plan to make option 1 not an outright, proper attack of Echain on Netherlands.

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81 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sun Feb 26, 2017 6:34 pm

As mister Gollveig stated, it is pretty obvious that the Partisans will eventually be victorious, considering the popular support they enjoy in their most populous regions. It is also becoming clear that the Empire is slowly losing international support. The British, their main allies, are rumoured to be pushing for an autonomous federal state under the Imperial monarch. Considering this, I see no good reason to send an army to aid the Partisans militarily. If we are going to help the Partisans - which I'm not against - and hope to gain a loyal ally, then we should be focussing on sending diplomatic or political aid.

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82 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Sun Feb 26, 2017 6:51 pm

I suggest we send skilled craftsmen, engineers, farmers, teachers and eager political activists. We help build their infrastructure and political structure. We use soft power, but not on the international stage. They don't need our help in that arena.

This will be a drain on Echain for a short time, but I think it will pay off in the long run.

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83 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Mon Feb 27, 2017 1:24 am

Gollvieg mulls over the situation for a little bit contemplating what Lorinbas said. "I think I have an idea for option 1. Instead of a large scale land war with the Empire and It's allies, we can do a false flag operation focused on their ability to commit to the occupation.

It will take some political wrangling but I can create a decoy mercenary company that would not be connected to us politically. In addition I can make it so that this company on record rents our airfield in Northport temporarily.

I have some contacts on the black market that I am sure can secure us Japanese Fighters, Bombers, and Torpedo Bombers. If it just happens that this mercenary compay accepts a contract with Gracemeria while they rent our airfield, well... we can't help what a private company does with it's own time. We just collect the rent.

The Empire does not have any air power so with air superiority the Gracemerians can retake their country in a matter of months instead of years."

Gollvieg pauses, waiting to hear everyone's thoughts

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84 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Mon Feb 27, 2017 1:36 am

That''s needlessly complicated and there's been no suggestion Darpon has any pilots. If we were to do this, I'd want to train Echaini for the role and have them be 'volunteers'.

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85 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Mon Feb 27, 2017 1:47 am

"I can get the pilots and the munitions, I just need the political capital and if you can throw some money my way it would be helpful in hiring some real pilots"

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86 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Mon Feb 27, 2017 10:41 am

I would like to suggest we could also look to East Indonesia as a way to expand our sphere of interrest.

(ooc: I wrote a piece about the gameplay possibilities of this in the ooc threat)

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87 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Mon Feb 27, 2017 10:49 am

OOC: Just to be clear, Felix will not return to this debate. Also, lest you forget, is this a proper session capable of action, i.e. are decisions made here legal? Wink

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88 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Wed Mar 01, 2017 5:28 am

OOC: We only need a 5/9 vote to make it legal, right now though, it is merely a discussion.

IC: The sad truth is that on the world stage we are less insignificant, we are invisible. We are a tiny, backwards, pathetic confederacy of small nations that pretend at being one unified country. We were so insignificant that they only people willing to take us seriously was the Japanese and even then the US did not even bother to make us a protectorate. But being invisible has it's advantages, as long as we stay quiet we can avoid the attention of the big fish like the US and the Soviets. To be honest, this would be the easy path, living in obscurity, poverty, and waiting for the next attack from one small corporate power or another.

But it doesn't have to be that way, we have a chance to prevent our nation from falling through the cracks. Our primary trump card is that Echain has a name that is known throughout the world, "The Island of the Dead"

This means that even if it is just a joke, we have a name for ourselves. It is up to us to take full advantage of this name. No matter what we decide to do, send military aid, humanitarian or diplomatic action, we still have to do the same steps.

1) Ally with New Zealand and Australia, this is the only way we can gain a position strong enough to talk to the UK. I hold some extremely valuable data that the UK would be desperate to get a hold of, enough that they would leave our allies and Indonesia alone.

2) We need to begin conducting landing excercises with Darpon. Do not let unexperienced politicians fool you. Every army in the world conduct training ops right before an Operation so that the Troops know what to do even without orders. We must do this even if we do not plan to send in the troops because politically it states that we are willing to go through with an invasion if the diplomatic option fails.

3) We need better ships and we cannot afford to build them ourselves, it would take too long and they would be of poor quality. We actually need to purchase the ships ourselves. This would drastically increase our political power in the region.

4) We need to show our strong support of Indonesia, forget trying to add it Echain or expand, we need to support them because it is right and we stand to gain a very valuable ally in the Region if we do.

5) I cannot reveal it just yet but I have a political trump card that if used correctly, would be able to make people take our name seriously and give us a strong enough barginning position with the Dutch to make them back off without violence.

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89 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Wed Mar 01, 2017 6:07 am

While I agree with points 2 through 5, 1 is a problem. We should continue to have a good relationship with Australia and New Zealand and should look at forming trade agreements with them, but I believe it would be a mistake to enter into formal alliance with either country.

As a further suggestion, I would put it to the UN that we are in the best position to administer the Trust Territory of the Pacific Islands.

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90 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Wed Mar 01, 2017 7:05 am

OOC: Well, not 5/9. First, you'd have to change or repeal Protocol Act - which can only be done during a session anyways - and only then could this gathering become capable of passing laws or sanctioning national action.

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91 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Wed Mar 01, 2017 7:35 am

I agree with all 5 points, but would also like to remark on the first one. While Australia and New Zealand would be very valuable allies, it might also be pertinent to keeping friendly with the British. I must admit my international politics knowledge might not be very recent, but in my personal experience (having lived in Australia for several years), the British Commonwealth is not quite so oppressive as some seem to have portrayed it recently. Australia and New Zealand in particular have been treated as associated countries rather than colonies in recent history, and I believe that they might be best served remaining aligned to the United Kingdom and its other allies. If anything, we should therefore strife to mend the relationship between the UK and the Commonwealth members, while establishing friendly (preferable allied) relationships with Australia and New Zealand, and if possible, the UK itself as well.

I'd like to point out that Echain, through the merit of encompasing many inhabitants of English descent, at least tangentally falls within the Anglo-Saxon cultural sphere. Furthermore, we should acknowledge that the UK is currently the second-largest military power in the region. And finally, in reference to Gollveig's third point, considering the end of the war, Britain most likely will have ships it will be willing to sell to a friendly partner.

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92 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Wed Mar 01, 2017 12:50 pm

Felix Clary zu Osegg wrote:OOC: Well, not 5/9. First, you'd have to change or repeal Protocol Act - which can only be done during a session anyways - and only then could this gathering become capable of passing laws or sanctioning national action.

Giving directions to the Delegation for Foreign Affairs doesn't require legislation, does it?

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93 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Wed Mar 01, 2017 1:12 pm

OOC: It is an action of the Council, not of the Governors. Protocol rules all Council actions and how they can be taken. Thus, this discussion does not have powers of the Council.

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94 Re: LIBERATION OF GRACEMERIA [Private] on Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:28 pm

Governor WhiskeyWhiskers wrote:While I agree with points 2 through 5, 1 is a problem. We should continue to have a good relationship with Australia and New Zealand and should look at forming trade agreements with them, but I believe it would be a mistake to enter into formal alliance with either country.

As a further suggestion, I would put it to the UN that we are in the best position to administer the Trust Territory of the Pacific Islands.

We only need the Alliance because it would give us more Political Capital. A trade agreement would be agreeable if we can deal with the UK directly. Also, the Islands of the Pacific Mandate could be a good addition to us.

Governor Ceca Sander wrote:I agree with all 5 points, but would also like to remark on the first one. While Australia and New Zealand would be very valuable allies, it might also be pertinent to keeping friendly with the British. I must admit my international politics knowledge might not be very recent, but in my personal experience (having lived in Australia for several years), the British Commonwealth is not quite so oppressive as some seem to have portrayed it recently. Australia and New Zealand in particular have been treated as associated countries rather than colonies in recent history, and I believe that they might be best served remaining aligned to the United Kingdom and its other allies. If anything, we should therefore strife to mend the relationship between the UK and the Commonwealth members, while establishing friendly (preferable allied) relationships with Australia and New Zealand, and if possible, the UK itself as well.

I'd like to point out that Echain, through the merit of encompasing many inhabitants of English descent, at least tangentally falls within the Anglo-Saxon cultural sphere. Furthermore, we should acknowledge that the UK is currently the second-largest military power in the region. And finally, in reference to Gollveig's third point, considering the end of the war, Britain most likely will have ships it will be willing to sell to a friendly partner.

I would love to talk the the Brits, they seem like reasonable people, and like I said, I have something they want.

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